What do these two things have in common? Evidently, nobody can predict which way either will go from this day forward. Bags are getting smaller, prices higher; shreds of soy are appearing, and rice-only carb source foods are dwindling. Grain-free costs an arm and a leg.

Most people agree there are major changes underway and more coming. Hopefully, most people can find it in themselves to acknowledge that some of us will be more intensely impacted by these changes than others.

In view of these changes, and the increase in tensions related to both, I'd like to call for an immediate moratorium on the Dog Food Bashing threads.

Many of us will have to scale down and cut back on things we never dreamed we'd have to. Nobody likes to be made to feel like a necessary economic decision is irresponsible. Nobody likes to post a question about a food and have the floodgates of negative speculation, careless misinformation, or personal prejudice (vs personal experience) unleashed. Nobody likes to be made to feel that by feeding a more affordable food, we are doing something wrong, or careless, or stupid. None of us with multiple pets and mounting bills and reduced access to credit want to be run through the Gauntlet of Guilt by those with ONE dog and lower household expenses.

Please continue to offer suggestions, guidance, personal experience, comparisons by cost, value for money, etc. But how about we also watch for opportunities to be supportive, understanding, compassionate about some decisions which are forced on us. Let's keep our fingers crossed for each other, rather than pointed at each other with condemnation.

I think we'd all gain a little peace of mind if we laid off the "That food is CRAP", "Don't EVER buy anything with corn, soy, blah, blah, blah..." unless the person posting has stated or questioned the possibility that their dog is allergic to or intolerant of corn, soy, blah, blah, blah.

Sound like something everyone can commit to for awhile??

I agree! It's always a good idea to SUGGEST what some of us believe to good/better quality foods or some alternatives, but I also think that we can sometimes go overboard on worrying about the minutia of what each kibble has or doesn't have.

Heck, my human kids will eat hot dogs, french fries and potato chips from time to time and I certainly don't lose sleep by feeling guilty that I'm not taking care of my kids. I won't be doing that about my dogs either.

Absolutely! I am all for this :) Great idea, Lisa!

Well said. Thank you!

:iagree:

No bashing here. I totally agree.

As always, :hail:

Great idea!

Well said and put!

Well said, Zen. I agree 100%!

well said, :iagree: :thankyou2:

In total agreement. Thank you for bringing this to everyone's attention, Lisa.

After reading this post,I joined this place. That was one good post and I have been lurking here for over a month now. I dont own a Lab,but I do have one dog and found myself here reading this board as opposed to my breeds boards. Reason for this being,people here seem to not be so stern in how one may provide for thier pets. Although you have all given great advice!
Please keep up the good work!!

After reading this post,I joined this place. That was one good post and I have been lurking here for over a month now. I dont own a Lab,but I do have one dog and found myself here reading this board as opposed to my breeds boards. Reason for this being,people here seem to not be so stern in how one may provide for thier pets. Although you have all given great advice!
Please keep up the good work!!

Welcome to the board!

There are plenty of us here with dogs other than labs, and I can attest to the fact that my greyhound has been treated as an equal, and shown support, affection, concern, and received advice equal to that offered for my Lab. The greyhound boards I have tried never came close to the welcome we have received here :thumb4:

ABSOLUTELY. People should feed their dog what they think is best and what they can afford. The point of this forum is to help people with that, not to bash anyone else's choice of food.

I find it sad you need to start such a thread. If your dog didn't do well on a certain food, I see no problem with saying so. I don't think broad, general, negative statements help make good decisions about chows.

Excellant idea! I have only one puppy but also a daughter and I am a single mother. The economic situation in the US has started really impacting us here in Canada and I have started to consider that it might not be a question of what I want to feed, rather what i can afford to feed. So I have been reading with intrest the other recomendations that are offered, as opposed to only sticking with the Solid Gold Wolf Cub my pup eats now. At 65.00 a bag, that may not last.

it's funny but on all the boards I've belonged to, it seems that we offer compassion on just about any other subject- but food, we are so unprepared bend in our ideals.

I certainly appreciate this reminder, thank you.

Excellent. No more food snobbery!!! ;)

I find it sad you need to start such a thread. If your dog didn't do well on a certain food, I see no problem with saying so. I don't think broad, general, negative statements help make good decisions about chows.

If your dog did poorly on a food I think you may certainly say so. I belive what she means is don't attack me for the food I feed if you think that food is garbage. At least for now. :)


Sigh. my Ol' Roy Rachael Ray is safe! :angel:

I agree. By the way in case anyone is counting that would be 16 positive reply's to the original poster! Way to go Zen!

Excellent thread Lisa. I've always felt that bashing or guilting a poster is uncalled for in good times or in bad times. Even in good economic times, certain individuals looking for suggestions may be struggling financially. One of my biggest pet peaves on this board is somebody saying they can't afford the premium brands and posters keep on telling them how much they'll save because they'll feed less. I've seen times where I couldn't dish out $50 or so dollars at one time for dog food no matter how much I might save over a couple of weeks.

Be kind and patient with people. The main thing is that the dog is loved and getting fed even if it's not the top of the line.

There should never be any bashing going on in any thread. This place should be about education, and sharing experiences not intimidation or guilt.

Well said and I agree!!

No problemo-- haven't bashed a food yet, don't plan on starting to either..

great post
reminders of what is really important are always welcome

all of us here have a lot more in common then we do in difference.

Funny that this thread is here, since we just switched our dog's food b/c of the high costs and the economy.

We had been feeding Blue Buff Fish & Sweet Pot., but since it's only a 30 lb bag, we've been going through 2 bags per month for my 2 dogs. And the price has gone up on it. It was costing us $50 per bag.

I just switched them to Nature's Recipe. It's almost $10 cheaper and I get 10lbs more per bag.

I don't understand why these super premium dog food bags are so small. Do they think we won't notice we're paying $50+ for only 30-35 lbs?

So far my dogs don't mind the switch. Of course, the economy has changed what we're buying for ourselves too!

That's a great idea. Thank you.

Excellent thread Lisa. I've always felt that bashing or guilting a poster is uncalled for in good times or in bad times. Even in good economic times, certain individuals looking for suggestions may be struggling financially. One of my biggest pet peaves on this board is somebody saying they can't afford the premium brands and posters keep on telling them how much they'll save because they'll feed less. I've seen times where I couldn't dish out $50 or so dollars at one time for dog food no matter how much I might save over a couple of weeks.

Be kind and patient with people. The main thing is that the dog is loved and getting fed even if it's not the top of the line.


I agree- it is not so much by choice that I have to feed Angel NB but by necessity- she'd allergic to everything else! And the "you'll feed less because it's a better kibble" is rubbish as far as I'm concerned, and this is why... Angel is smart but not THAT smart- she could care less if the bag of chow costs $10 or $100 she's going to eat all that I put infront of her! because she eats like a typical lab- she inhales everything within a 6 inch span of her snout! So can we please put that to rest. At least for my case with Angel the less because it's more is not true. Angel still gets the same 2 cups in the am as she gets the 2 cups in the pm.
As far as the bashing of foods- as long as your dog is healthy and happy charge on folks you are doing what is right by your pooch!

Blessings to All ! :angel:

Thank you for posting this! Makes me feel a little better...

We have to special order Lady's food from the local pet store, and just this last time the price shot up crazy! Like an extra 20 bucks!!! I couldn't believe and my family and I certainly can no longer afford it... it breaks my heart because she loves the food, it makes her coat beautiful, it's large kibble which forces her to chew, it's the perfect food for her, and now we're going to have to switch! Breaks my heart...

I never thought of how expensive it must be to feed more than one dog. We only have a dog and his food is $65-70 for a 30lb bag that barely lasts a month...plus the grain free treats...it's close to $1000/yr on dog food. It's definitely hard to part w/ the money for such a small amount of dog food but we do it because it's the only food he's improved on and because financially we can swing it now...but if a time ever came when we couldn't afford it, I don't think there's anything wrong with putting your dog(s) on the best food you can find for the money you can afford to spend...no one should make you feel guilty for that.

Good message Zen!

I don't agree.

When I came on here I stated that I was feeding Purina Dog Chow and I was a student so I didn't have a lot of money. People pointed out ingredients and that I would feed less with a higher quality food (which was true). I was new to dog ownership so I had no idea and switched Hudson soon after to Eagle Pack...which was nearly as cheap but had better ingredients. The changes I noticed in Hudson were immediate and even though I wasn't asking for help (because I thought I was doing the right thing) I was so happy to get that advice. Even if some of it was harsh.

Some of the cheapest foods are fantastic foods in my opinion. If we are low on cash we buy Kirkland Lamb and Rice or California Natural and if we have extra money we buy Innova Evo. This is the main reason I rotate.

HOWEVER I cannot say "That is a great food" to Beneful, Dog Chow or Ol'ROY because it was the advice on these foods that helped me see that it was a poor choice. Now I have taken dog nutrition classes and have talked many times with my Holistic Vet but I am still happy that this board guided me in the right direction. If we all say that these foods are great foods then many lurkers will come on and will keep on feeding it, and this I don't agree with.

As much as anything I don't think we should bash, but we should certainly educate. It is NOT about the most expensive foods, but about quality. How was I to know that corn wasn't a good ingredient to start with? I had never even looked at ingredients before. I like this board because of the opinions and without the opinions the board is lost to me. Many people have left that I consider friends and I think its a very sad thing.

As I said in the last post I made in Diet and Nutrition, I will not hang around here so you don't have to worry about me 'bashing' a food but I hope that people still get the Nutritional advice that I needed and recieved when I first joined....the way its going it is no longer a Nutrition forum is it?

I don't agree.

When I came on here I stated that I was feeding Purina Dog Chow and I was a student so I didn't have a lot of money. People pointed out ingredients and that I would feed less with a higher quality food (which was true). I was new to dog ownership so I had no idea and switched Hudson soon after to Eagle Pack...which was nearly as cheap but had better ingredients. The changes I noticed in Hudson were immediate and even though I wasn't asking for help (because I thought I was doing the right thing) I was so happy to get that advice. Even if some of it was harsh.

Some of the cheapest foods are fantastic foods in my opinion. If we are low on cash we buy Kirkland Lamb and Rice or California Natural and if we have extra money we buy Innova Evo. This is the main reason I rotate.

HOWEVER I cannot say "That is a great food" to Beneful, Dog Chow or Ol'ROY because it was the advice on these foods that helped me see that it was a poor choice. Now I have taken dog nutrition classes and have talked many times with my Holistic Vet but I am still happy that this board guided me in the right direction. If we all say that these foods are great foods then many lurkers will come on and will keep on feeding it, and this I don't agree with.

As much as anything I don't think we should bash, but we should certainly educate. It is NOT about the most expensive foods, but about quality. How was I to know that corn wasn't a good ingredient to start with? I had never even looked at ingredients before. I like this board because of the opinions and without the opinions the board is lost to me. Many people have left that I consider friends and I think its a very sad thing.

As I said in the last post I made in Diet and Nutrition, I will not hang around here so you don't have to worry about me 'bashing' a food but I hope that people still get the Nutritional advice that I needed and recieved when I first joined....the way its going it is no longer a Nutrition forum is it?

Tracy, I agree with you 100%, especially the bolded part. I too learned so much from this board about ingredients and I'm grateful for the comments which pushed me to do some research and learn more. I do not believe in bashing people either but I also do not believe that pointing out the deficiencies in a food is bashing - it's just the plain truth. I refuse to say "As long as your dog does good on it feed whatever" therefore I stopped posting in this section. It's almost become like the emperor's new clothes - people are afraid to say "That food is not good"

So, you don't agree with this?
In view of these changes, and the increase in tensions related to both, I'd like to call for an immediate moratorium on the Dog Food Bashing threads.

Many of us will have to scale down and cut back on things we never dreamed we'd have to. Nobody likes to be made to feel like a necessary economic decision is irresponsible. Nobody likes to post a question about a food and have the floodgates of negative speculation, careless misinformation, or personal prejudice (vs personal experience) unleashed. Nobody likes to be made to feel that by feeding a more affordable food, we are doing something wrong, or careless, or stupid. None of us with multiple pets and mounting bills and reduced access to credit want to be run through the Gauntlet of Guilt by those with ONE dog and lower household expenses.

Please continue to offer suggestions, guidance, personal experience, comparisons by cost, value for money, etc. But how about we also watch for opportunities to be supportive, understanding, compassionate about some decisions which are forced on us. Let's keep our fingers crossed for each other, rather than pointed at each other with condemnation.

I think we'd all gain a little peace of mind if we laid off the "That food is CRAP", "Don't EVER buy anything with corn, soy, blah, blah, blah..." unless the person posting has stated or questioned the possibility that their dog is allergic to or intolerant of corn, soy, blah, blah, blah.

Maybe you should read my original thread again.

I never said we should smile and nod when people say they're feeding their dog a food most of us would consider a less-informed choice that could be improved upon.

The types of posts I was hoping to eliminate or reduce are those that accuse people of feeding their dogs "McDonalds" or that they are "killing" their dogs by feeding them Brand X or accusing Brand X's manufacturer of being "famous for constant recalls" etc. If you think those types of posts don't exist, you're wrong.

This thread was posted with a hope for more civility and less hysteria in this section of the board, not less information.

Lisa, I don't disagree with your thread but I do not like how it's been used lately. Tracey posted this in a recent thread:

Its kind of like Humans and fast food...we like it a little too much and in the short term its okay for us but in the long term is causes all kinds of problems. I have a problem with any kibble that does not have meat and adds artificial flavouring. It is mostly corn and I don't believe dogs should live off of just corn and fillers.

For the record, my dogs LOVE beneful (like I love Wendy's) and my friend was using it so they were always excited to go to her house. I feel with the knowledge we have about dog kibble and long term health we should do everything in our power to keep our dogs healthy...my friends dog has teeth problems and has recently been diagnosed with cancer. She now feeds innova. Can't say if it was due to the food but why risk it?

This was posted back at her.

I think some folks here have recently forgotten Lisa's wonderful sticky thread. So, just in case anyone happens to go through a bit of a brain fart before responding to this thread, here's the link to reread and refresh your memory...

http://www.lab-retriever.net/board/g...-t7302860.html

To the OP, while Beneful wouldn't be my first choice, I can't discount how many dogs who have indeed lived happy and healthy on it. Dogs can't read, so if it works for you and you & your dog are happy with it, that's all that matters!...and in these economic times especially. Good luck!

So apparently some people do believe we should all just smile and nod and keep our mouths shut.

So you felt that because Tracey got a response neither of you liked in another thread, that both of you should state in this thread that you don't agree there is a need for more civility in dog food discussions in this section?

Lisa - I'll pm you.

So, you don't agree with this?


Maybe you should read my original thread again.

I never said we should smile and nod when people say they're feeding their dog a food most of us would consider a less-informed choice that could be improved upon.

The types of posts I was hoping to eliminate or reduce are those that accuse people of feeding their dogs "McDonalds" or that they are "killing" their dogs by feeding them Brand X or accusing Brand X's manufacturer of being "famous for constant recalls" etc. If you think those types of posts don't exist, you're wrong.

This thread was posted with a hope for more civility and less hysteria in this section of the board, not less information.

No I agree with what you said, but I don't agree with the way people are taking your thread and stating that we need to agree with everyone's post on dog food. I wanted to add my opinion to this thread so people could see that I have read it and what my views are on the subject. I didn't like that everyone just said "Glad its working for you" in the Beneful thread. I don't care that people don't agree with me, but I do care that we are allowed to voice our opinions.

Just as a sidenote - I didn't say that Beneful was like eating McDonalds I was saying that I like eating McDonalds A LOT (their fries...) as a human but it still doesn't mean its good for me. So even though Dogs LOVE foods like Beneful it doesn't always mean its healthy for them...some of my favourite foods are unhealthy ones. Obviously a dog kibble is going to be more balanced than eating fast food. Just wanted to clarify that....

wow its amazing how such a positive post got turned into something so upsetting to people

I really do think that misses the spirit and intention of the ZenCat's original post.

While I think the information posted here, and very valuable, and its great to see what works and does not work for other people in real life honest discussions based on person experience.

this dialog can exist without it turning into dram or negativity

nobody is all knowing, and if somebody was, they certainly would not be posting on a message board

I have seen posts where people criticize "5 star foods" and notes of dogs doing poorly on several "top brands" and plenty of people criticizing less then highly "ranked" food sources, and accounts of dogs improving drastically when they were switche toe "premium" foods.

its quite possible for people to completley believe both sides of the food debate, and site first hand experience.

this tells me the verdict is still out, just like people that say a glass of wine is good for you, while others swear that the key to good health it no alchohol ever

while I see nothing wrong with differing opininons, for its discussions of our differences that we learn from

the most improtant part in this process is to listen, and be open minded and kind

while I see nothing wrong with differing opininons, for its discussions of our differences that we learn from

the most improtant part in this process is to listen, and be open minded and kind


That was the primary reason I joined this board...to learn. I am pretty new to this forum, and for the most part, I enjoy learning and listening to different point of views. But, gosh, I have never had one or two members of any forum totally rub me the wrong way like they have here. It is disappointing. Although the other forum I belong to does not have as much information as this forum, folks there are very respectful even when they don't necessarily agree with you.

Hi Zencat I was just trying to respond to a post from May but it was locked i couldn't reply. Just wanted to say thanks for the information you had posted about anorexia in dogs. I was the one whose girl didn't want to eat. She gained all her weight back and is currently doing well, but is starting to do that picky thing again by not wanting to finish her dinner. Her fur grew back in, it's a mirracle.

But yeah I had one heck of an experience with dog food, learned two darn things are most important, if your dog has an appetite and will eat thats good thing no matter what brand. Secondly, about diarrhea, I spoke to Purina and they recommended when introducing new food, reduce old food by 10 percent and replace with 10 percent of the new- over a ten day period..... (If your dog is sensitive I personally would replace 20 kibbles at a time out of 2 cups) Then absolutely watch the stool for mucous which means theres some irritation going on. If diarrhea presents do a bland diet until it clears, then try over again. If your switch is unsuccessful go back to the original and find another brand, wait a week or two and try the new brand. Some dogs stomachs are really sensitive, and you don't want them getting dehydrated cuz of the dirrhea and stuff. Count your blessings your animal is healthy.

I don't think anybody is saying Beneful or Ol Roy is great food, but the purpose of the thread is to be respectful of those that can't afford better because of the tough economic times we're going thru.

Throughtout my life I've seen good times and bad times. During the bad times it might not be the healthiest, but a Krystal cheeseburger was a treat and we made a big pot of potato soup last a week. If all I could afford to feed my kids during tough times was mac and cheese, then that's what they ate and I felt good that I was able to provide that.

During the good times eating a steak at Longhorns once a week was no big deal.

I see it no different with dog food. I can promise you that the dog doesn't mind having to suffer thru it for a little while. He's just happy to be loved and a roof over his head like the rest of us.

I got bashed here once because I saw someone in Walmart buying Ol Roy and I didn't bother to educate them on a better food. I'm sorry, it's not my place to judge unless the dog is being abused or neglected. Then I would definately speak up.

yes ..please don't tell but I have a boston terrier along with my lab.I've been bashed enough ..JUST KIDDING...

I haven't been active on this forum for very long so I'm not sure what history of "food bashing" there is. I think that we should all be sensitive to people's financial situations and their beliefs. However there is a lack of regulation on dog food so I think that sharing information is crucial since the general public is majorly deceived by some of these companies that overprice their sub-standard product and continue to make FALSE claims about it. I believe we must continue amicable conversations so that we can educate each other and not be fooled by these companies.

Must say this is a great thread!!!

So many people are hurting right now, and looking for ways to save every cent they can. Steak gets traded in for hamburger, hamburger for beans, Starbucks becomes a treat and not a daily stop. It's only natural the fur kids, might have to cut back too.

If you think about it, commercial dog food wasn't invented until the mid 1800s, but dogs have been around for thousands of years. Not to mention, the super good stuff now on the market is a very recent item. Sure it would be great if every dog could have a perfect diet, however most humans have problems eating a perfect diet.

The cheapest of the cheap, might be far cry from perfection, but there are a lot worse alternatives. So many people are having to give up their pets, and there is a record number of folks just abandoning them.

Hmm wonder if the food banks ever get dog food, or if anyone has ever thought of opening a pet food bank.

i agree i was so confused after some of the threads, i just wanted something good for my dog