I just got off the phone with Natura. They told me they do not advise mixing their foods (something about nutritional deficiencies could occur). I was going to go back to half CN lamb and rice adult and half CN lamb and rice puppy. They advised against it. We have done 1/4 c EVO and 3/4 c CN lamb and rice adult and now Charlie's eye boogers are back. He does not have them on just he CN lamb.

Anyway, now I'm back to square 1. Natura recommended I do the CN chicken and rice for Charlie or Healthwise. Not sure I want to change foods, but do want to increase protein/fat. What do you guys think of the CN chicken and rice?

Nancy

I have been mixing 1/2 CN Chicken and Rice and 1/2 EVO Adult for my dogs for 6 weeks now. Things are going well. I can appreciate that the Natura reps would need to say not to mix. They haven't done any testing with that and can't really stand behind it. After looking at the nutritional analysis of both formulas I'm mixing, I feel comfortable about doing it as one of the kibble rotations we go through every few months. But everyone needs to decide for themselves.

Have you considered the CN Chicken Meal and Rice Puppy formula? If I needed a very simple formula for any of my dogs of any age, I'd like the 26% protein and 16% fat levels.

I must have talked to a different rep.. but they said 20 % EVO RF was ok into the Cal Nat Lamb Adult.. but that was six months ago...

Satch has essentially done a food trial (six month) and is in good health , but I give a lot of home cooked meat too..... but I want to go EVO lg. bites 100 % if his system tolerates it..

There are the TOTW diets ( they say OK for Lg. breed pups because it does not have a lot of calories)...and Wellness core(1 yr old and over) that offer grain free--higher protein , but not excessive.... and the Orijen Lg, breed puppy...

It is not wrong to go with your idea.... it may or may not work... but in some cases be just right for a dog..

100 % complete is a myth.. .. you could also look into adding pre package raw like Steves real food, Bravo, etc if a dealer is nearby.

Luckyluna - that makes sense about Natura not doing any research about mixing foods so they can't say go ahead and mix. I did think about going to straight CN lamb and rice puppy and still might do that though it is a bit more difficult to get here. It does bother me that in the CN chicken and rice adult (the nutrient analysis says protein at 25% ) fiber is just 1.5%. I think that's a bit low.

Uplander, when I mentioned mixing foods I said half and half and they advised against that. I bet 80/20 is not a problem. I'm pretty convinced now since it has happened again with the eye boogers that Charlie has a problem with potatoes. He gets these eye boogers every time there are potatoes in the food I think. Potatoes are third in EVO.

I ended up buying a bag of Healthwise lamb meal and oatmeal. Protein is 26% and fat is 16%. It has 428 calories k/cup as opposed to CN lamb and rice puppy which is 535. It seems like a simple food and the carbs are a lot less than CN lamb and rice and CN chicken and rice. But, with my luck it won't work. . .

Nancy

What I do to up the protein for CN lamb and rice is add canned. EVO makes a 95% meat cans so I use that as toppers. I alternate the chicken/turkey and red meat along with canned wild alaskan salmon.

What I do to up the protein for CN lamb and rice is add canned. EVO makes a 95% meat cans so I use that as toppers. I alternate the chicken/turkey and red meat along with canned wild alaskan salmon.

How much do you add? And how much do you think it raises the protein level? I do that too with Wellness 95% meat, but I don't know how much I'm raising the protein/fat levels. I only add a couple of spoonfuls.

Nancy

I think the Healthwise you bought looks like a good formula to try. There's a lot to like about it - at least on paper. Time will tell, I guess.

I know what you mean about the fiber % in the CN line. I always add a spoonful of plain canned pumpkin for extra fiber (in my CN and EVO mix) if I'm not mixing anything else in. I heard somewhere that Natura is working on adding more fiber to some of their formulas.

When I add some canned to kibble, I give 3/4 cup kibble (instead of the usual 1 cup) and add 1/3 to 1/2 can. It's not too scientific, but seems to work for us.

I think the Healthwise you bought looks like a good formula to try. There's a lot to like about it - at least on paper. Time will tell, I guess.

I know what you mean about the fiber % in the CN line. I always add a spoonful of plain canned pumpkin for extra fiber (in my CN and EVO mix) if I'm not mixing anything else in. I heard somewhere that Natura is working on adding more fiber to some of their formulas.

When I add some canned to kibble, I give 3/4 cup kibble (instead of the usual 1 cup) and add 1/3 to 1/2 can. It's not too scientific, but seems to work for us.

Thanks for the tips. I am a bit reluctant to try the Healthwise as I had one of my other labs on the Active formula and he did horrible on it. Truthfully, I want to stick with the CN lamb and rice so maybe I'll just add in more canned. I don't know - get such a headache over dog food. I used to add Primal raw nuggets to one of my labs dry foods and that worked well.
Charlie just does so well on the CN lamb and rice - I hate to go and mess things up, but I also know it's probably good to rotate, but he's only been on the CN lamb and rice for a few months. Decisions, decisions. It's also the fact that Charlie has hip dysplasia and I have to be careful.

Nancy

What type of potato is it? I've heard that some dogs can have issues with regular potatoes, but do great on sweet potatoes.

A past poster was really good about explaining the ratio of the canned food to the dry ones but I can't remember how it was done. My boys get about 1/4 can a day to about 1 cup of kibble. Seems to work for us.

It's regular potatoes I think. For some reason he gets eye boogers on any food that contains regular potatoes. I used to think it was from something in the NuVet tablets I used to get, but I stopped them so it's not that. Weird. No eye boogers on the CN lamb and rice though.

I use to have the formula to convert canned food percentages to dry food percentages, but then I switched computers and that's gone. Maybe I can find it.

Nancy

I think this might be the formula you're looking for. I always think I'm going to remember it, but then I always have to look it up again. Hope this helps.

Here is a formula to help you convert the guaranteed analysis table into a dry matter profile for easier comparison.

Begin at 100%, and subtract the percentage of moisture listed on the label. The remaining percentage gives us the actual amount of dry matter in the food product. Next, we take the listed percentage of one of the main nutrients, and divide that number by the percentage of dry matter. This will give us the actual dry matter percentage of each nutrient in the food.

For example, let's say the water
content of a particular brand of canned dog food is listed as 75%, and the crude protein content analysis is guaranteed to be a minimum of 6%. Subtracting the 75% water content from the 100% total product leaves us with 25% dry matter. Now, divide that 6% protein by the 25% dry matter and we get a dry matter protein content of 24%.

Yep, that's the one (and then multiply by 100) right? Thanks for finding it. Dog food - the more you know the more complicated it gets LOL

Nancy

I just got off the phone with Natura. They told me they do not advise mixing their foods (something about nutritional deficiencies could occur). I was going to go back to half CN lamb and rice adult and half CN lamb and rice puppy. They advised against it. We have done 1/4 c EVO and 3/4 c CN lamb and rice adult and now Charlie's eye boogers are back. He does not have them on just he CN lamb.

Anyway, now I'm back to square 1. Natura recommended I do the CN chicken and rice for Charlie or Healthwise. Not sure I want to change foods, but do want to increase protein/fat. What do you guys think of the CN chicken and rice?

Nancy
Joe and Andy are on CN Chicken and Rice, and have been for most of their lives. I've never found it necessary to add anything additional for protein amplification even though Joe is an extremely active dog, and he is stunningly healthy.

Kelly

Hi Kelly,

I just found out today that the nutrient analysis for the chicken and rice is 25% (guaranteed is 21%). That's pretty good, but I just wish the fiber was a little higher. When I tried the the chicken and rice Charlie had really hard, hard poops. Do you find that at all with Joe and Andy?

Nancy

I bought my first bag of EVO Lg. bites yesterday... I'm was very impressed with the kibble shape.. Big squares and very dark...the EVO RF is small and light and very dry because of the fact they add extra protein and reduced fat amount..And my piggy boy liked it mixed in...so as I use up my EVO RF I'll let you know how Satch does on a Cal Nat / EVO Lg bite mix...which may lead into EVO all by itself....

I hope your new selection of HealthWise works...I fed that to my last lab on a rotation and she did well on it... Good luck !

Like Kelly has told you it's the quality of the protein vs the amount percentage wise...A diet like Pro Plan Performance with with 30 - 20 has it's protein coming from grains(Corn Gluten) and a little meat ...Your Cal Nat Lamb which has been working at 22- 12 as fed may be giving the same or better results because of its absorption into the body....Numbers on the bag only tell you so much...its how the dog looks and reacts to a diet..I would stick with Cal Nat Lamb and add sardines , salmon, or other fresh meats occasionally where you are dealing with multiple health issues.

Joe and Andy are on CN Chicken and Rice, and have been for most of their lives. I've never found it necessary to add anything additional for protein amplification even though Joe is an extremely active dog, and he is stunningly healthy.

Kelly

:tup: For a long time, I had thought that the protein level in CN was too low for my active boys, especially Tanner. Our vet took some time and looked at all the ingredients and said he thought the protein was just fine and there was no need to add anything. Both dogs are in great health and have beautiful coats.

I've been using for the last 10 days EVO large bites (red meat) instead of the EVO reduced fat to supplement the CN Lamb & Rice because of just how active Molly is right now...thinking that the added fat may help her with her weight loss issue. I've upped from 20% to more like 30% of her meal as well.

Just to toss things up, when we get close to running out of this bag of food, I may rotate the girls onto the food I'm mixing in with Belle's CN Chicken & Rice - Wellness Core Ocean. Molly has never dived into a food bin before and she seems to really like it.

You know Charlie does look good now on the CN lamb and rice. He's been on it a few months. Wasn't so sure not too long ago since he had a little dry skin. I also give him coconut oil in the morning and fish oil at night now. I haven't started the Healthwise - kind of chickening out.

I've decided to do what I did with my last lab and that was I added a few primal raw nuggets to his dry food. I bought some today and opened the bag to defrost a few and Charlie was drooling. I'm probably not suppose to do that either, but it worked well for my last lab and I'm sure there is a lot of protein there.

Nancy

I'm sure the raw nuggets will probably be fine for now; and Charlie will probably think they're the best thing ever. Let us know how things go.

I had tried the Healthwise for Autumn and wasn't happy with it. Went back to Calif. natural for her and added prozyme. Everybody eats it with some coconut oil. They all look awesome.

I had tried the Healthwise for Autumn and wasn't happy with it. Went back to Calif. natural for her and added prozyme. Everybody eats it with some coconut oil. They all look awesome.

Which one did you try? Do you remember why you weren't happy with it? Just curious.

Nancy

Which one did you try? Do you remember why you weren't happy with it? Just curious.

Nancy

I had tried the chicken for Autumn and she still had really large stools. I then put her on Calif. Natural Lamb & Rice but added some Prozyme and her stools got alot better, smaller and firmer.