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  1. #1
    Real Retriever alixb's Avatar
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    Chronic Hock Issue ~ anyone familiar with this?

    My girl Sunny has a chronic hock issue. What it is, is not really known. My Vet thinks it's Osteochondritis Dissecans. She injured it when she was younger & it has never healed well due to her living at a breeders & playing with big dogs all the time.
    The last few months were really good, but since we got a lot of snow, she was playing more & at the end of the day, she was limping.
    I have curtailed her playing for now.
    The breeder told me she gave he Meloxicam & Tramadol for it.
    any experience with this?
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  2. #2
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    Not personally, but OCD is usually a developmental disorder where the initial problem occurs during growth (same as elbow dysplasia). Surgery is an option on a younger dog, but I would guess that similarly to elbow dysplasia, in an older dog the arthritis has already set in and surgery would no longer provide much benefit. There are plenty of supplements you can give that help with arthritis (personally we used a human joint supplement with MSM, chondroitin, glucosamine and hyaluronic acid, along with fish oil and vitamin C on our elbow dog). We also had some success with acupuncture, although not so much that we didn’t need NSAIDS, first occasionally, then as she aged, daily.

    For your peace of mind about it, you could always ask for an evaluation from an orthopedic specialist, but your description of her being ok until she used it more than she had been does sound a lot like the initial stages of arthritis setting in. If she were mine, I would start her on joint supplements if she isn’t already, focus on keeping her at a healthy weight, keep up with regular low-impact exercise, and ask the vet for an NSAID (such as meloxicam or rimadyl) for days when she’s overdone it a little.
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  3. #3
    Real Retriever alixb's Avatar
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    I really appreciate this sound advice. I am not a huge supplement person though. Never really see proof if they work or not. She has reduced her weight since I got her. she LOVES to play & loves to swim. i guess i want her to have fun too. Tough to weigh it all out. BTW; your dogs are gorgeous.

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  5. #4
    Senior Dog windycanyon's Avatar
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    Alix, up until a few years ago, there was a joint evaluation program at UC Davis I think... called Wind-Morgan. So instead of just hips and elbows, they also looked at shoulders and hocks. Hock OCD is a tough one from what I gleaned from my vet who used the program (because she had some hock and shoulder issues in the lines). I was told surgical options on hocks weren't good. I personally would try MSM (a sulfur supplement). It's cheap, you can't over do it since the dog will excrete it out. Not sure why you are against supps but Ive taken it for my back (broke it) and for SLE for years. Don't know what I'd do w/o it to be honest. You can buy 100% pure MSM from your Cenex or Tractor Supply store.
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  7. #5
    Real Retriever alixb's Avatar
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    thanks for this. I was in the fitness industry & studied a lot on supplements & physiology anatomy etc. The last thing I read about glucosamine, could not produce new cartilage. I could be wrong. I am not against supplements per say, it just seems that there are so many different kinds out there & It hard to get a good read on what actually works. I will go back to my Vet who I adore & is very practical. I love your dogs. How did you get them to pose??

  8. #6
    Senior Dog Snowshoe's Avatar
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    Are you familiar with Cartrophen Vet? If she has arthritis that might help. It might help a lot. We used it on two dogs and one cat, could really see a difference. For the cat my VEt supplied pre-loaded syringes and I did the injections myself. I believe studies show it stimulates the production of cartilage and synovial fluid.
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  9. #7
    Senior Dog Berna's Avatar
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    Good joint supplements don't only contain glucosamine and chondroitine but some other things as well, i.e. vitamin C which acts as an antiinflamatory or devil's claw which helps with the pain. I don't know whether they help, or if they help combined with other things, like mild exercise and physical therapy, but my dog who has spondylosis, hip and elbow dysplasia and had hip surgery after being hit by a car, is still active and happy at 10.5 years old.
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  10. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berna View Post
    Good joint supplements don't only contain glucosamine and chondroitine but some other things as well, i.e. vitamin C which acts as an antiinflamatory or devil's claw which helps with the pain. I don't know whether they help, or if they help combined with other things, like mild exercise and physical therapy, but my dog who has spondylosis, hip and elbow dysplasia and had hip surgery after being hit by a car, is still active and happy at 10.5 years old.
    I take the same joint supplements as my dogs (I get them human ones, LOL), and it does seem to help relieve the pain from the severe arthritis I have in my big toe. I haven’t bother experimenting with single ingredient ones to see what if anything is working. My mom did, and for her glucosamine seemed most important, but I know other people who swear it is MSM or chondroitin. So I just take (and give to the dogs) a multi-ingredient one to cover my bases. Is it a complete panacea? No, all my arthritic dogs (and I) did need the occasional pain killer, but it reduced the need for it.
    Annette

    Cookie (HIT HC Jamrah's Legally Blonde, UDX, OM2, BN) 6/4/2015
    Sassy (HIT Jamrah's Blonde Ambition, UDX, OM2, BN) 6/4/2015

    Chloe (HIT HC OTCH Windsong's Femme Fatale, UDX4, OM6, RE) 6/7/2009

    And remembering:

    Scully (HC Coventry's Truth Is Out There, UD, TD, RN) 4/14/1996 - 6/30/2011
    Mulder (Coventry's I Want To Believe, UD, RN, WC) 5/26/1999 - 4/22/2015

    And our foster Jolie (Windsong's Genuine Risk, CDX) 5/26/1999 - 3/16/2014

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  11. #9
    Real Retriever alixb's Avatar
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    Hi Everyone: thanks for the suggestions. i am taking her to the Vet tomorrow so i don't have to guess anymore. Great comments.
    -beautiful-sunny-jpg

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  13. #10
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    Really doesn't matter the exact etiology of the lesion as the treatment and prognosis will be the same. Keep the weight down, moderate exercise and use joint supplements (yes, they do work). Do NOT rely on NSAIDs long term as they have a lot of side effects, but if you must use them on an as needed base, use a newer generation NSAIS instead of Rimadyl (carprofen is the generic Rimadyl) as Rimadyl has a higher potential for long term side effects than the newer ones. I won't get into the exact reason, but it is the truth. There are many natural anti-inflammatory supplements and pain supplements, and yes, they work. I like using a human homeopathic remedy called T-relief for arthritis. In Europe, they did double blind studies with this and found that in 30 days it was just as effective as the popular NSAIDs used on dogs. Digestive enzymes have been used successfully as part of the pain/inflammation control in the body. Using wholesome, non-processed food will decrease inflammatory cytokines in the body that exacerbate arthritis. Acupuncture is very effective if your acupuncturist knows what he is doing. If the condition gets terribly bad, many orthopedic surgeons will fuse the joint and this can be very effective. A fellow in Sun Valley, Idaho is doing hock replacement surgery to the tune of $7000 if you care to jump into that mode . And, don't forget to support the other leg as it will take on the load of the hindquarter work. Good luck. I think that is about all I know about this.

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