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  • Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
    Results 11 to 18 of 18
    1. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by smartrock View Post
      So, would this be like pernicious anemia in humans? What symptoms are you seeing? I don't know anything about it, just the B12 deficiency made me think pernicious anemia.
      Not quite. Usually there is an issue with the pancreas where the body's digestive enzymes don't work to digest food. Because there is now excess undigested food in the small intestine, this produces an overload of bad gut bacteria. The bad bacteria depletes the b-12 supply in the body. Because the b-12 supply is now depleted and because there is excess bacteria in the small intestine, the folate level is increased.

      The symptoms are consistently loose stools, poor coat, gas, and trouble maintaining weight.

      My guess is that if it is EPI it's a very mild case. Basically with EPI the body starves itself. He's definitely not starving.

      I guess a lot of times the b-12 injections right the bad bacteria problems.

      I really think he has a bacterial problem in his gut, but I chose to go this route to get a definitive diagnosis before treating.


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    2. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by Meeps83 View Post
      Not quite. Usually there is an issue with the pancreas where the body's digestive enzymes don't work to digest food. Because there is now excess undigested food in the small intestine, this produces an overload of bad gut bacteria. The bad bacteria depletes the b-12 supply in the body. Because the b-12 supply is now depleted and because there is excess bacteria in the small intestine, the folate level is increased.

      The symptoms are consistently loose stools, poor coat, gas, and trouble maintaining weight.

      Oban, acute, not chronic. Mild harsh coat most of his life, till now.


      My guess is that if it is EPI it's a very mild case. Basically with EPI the body starves itself. He's definitely not starving.

      Oban did not have EPI.


      I guess a lot of times the b-12 injections right the bad bacteria problems.


      I really think he has a bacterial problem in his gut, but I chose to go this route to get a definitive diagnosis before treating.

      To replace good gut bacteria Oban had the faecal implant.


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      Hmmm, this is sounding like Oban but with exceptions noted above.

    3. #13
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      For Heaven's Sake. My short term and long term memory are shot. I woke up in the middle of the night last night thinking, did I save that new album I created with Oban's health links in it? Nope, I didn't. I am busy for the next couple of days but will try again, sorry if you looked.

    4. #14
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      Anyone who has posted in this thread interested in helping out at this thread?

      The Itchy Dog Project - University of Nottingham, UK

    5. #15
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      Updates!

      Sorry I don't have exact numbers.

      Pancreas is fine and Maverick does not have EPI. He does have a Cobalamin and a Folic Acid deficiency.

      He is on 1000 mcg of B-12 daily and 400 mcg of folic acid. He has to take the b-12 for 12 weeks and the folic acid for 4 weeks. After 12 weeks we'll check his levels again.

      It's been about a month on b-12 and his fur looks and feels a little better. His dandruff is gone, he has more of an appetite, and he has more energy. He's gained weight, I don't know how much but I'm guessing 2 pounds. Plus his poop is formed and fairly normal. It still gets soft, especially if he's marking with his poop (does anyone else's dog poop as soon as they go to an area with other dogs?)

      Hopefully things continue to improve over the coming weeks!


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    7. #16
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      Haven't read the posts so I hope I am not redundant. Cobalamin deficiency in pets is usually a secondary complication of inflammatory bowel disease. About 35 years ago, a British researcher found that cobalamin and folate are often deficient in pets with chronic bowel inflammation. He was invited to set up a gastrointestinal laboratory at Texas A&M University veterinary college and has lead the way in bowel research in pets for years. His work with pancreatitis has been extremely helpful for clinicians. Cobalamin (vitamin B12) plays a critical role in the proper function of the gut. It is sort of a vicious cycle. When the gut is chronically inflamed, there will be improper absorption of cobalamin from natural sources, leading to deficiency. Without the cobalamin, which is required for proper gut function, the bowel cannot function normally, hence the vicious cycle. IMHO, all pets with chronic bowel disease should have a profile done at the GI lab to check for these deficiencies. Some vets will opt to just give B12 injections to cover this possibility. I will leave that up to you. The key thing to remember is that it has to be given by injection to be effective until the bowel has healed. I personally give 4-6 injections, depending on the assessed level. I have seen a few vets tell clients that they must do the injections indefinitely. I do not believe this is needed. Hope this helps.

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      Georgia (04-25-2017)

    9. #17
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      I would also add that there are very good protocols used to heal the damaged gut, including the use of bone broth, probiotics and natural treatments for Candida overgrowth. That and a healthy, balanced, non-processed diet.

    10. #18
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      An update on Maverick!

      We are now on week 12 of B12 and Folate supplementation. The GI studies were done at Texas A&M and they recommended either oral or injected treatments. Due to cost, our vet recommended we do oral treatments and if it did not work we could do injections.

      We have been on 1000mg of B12 for 11 full weeks. We have been on 400mcg of Folic Acid for 3 full weeks. We have continued with the probiotics/digestive enzymes. We eliminated Fish Oil (for the time being) and switched foods.

      After probably 5-6 weeks of the B12 supplementation Maverick's poops were about 90% improved on a very consistent basis. Our vet gave us the OK to switch our food back to a chicken based whole grain food and continue to monitor. The poops continued to improve to the point where I do not recall the last time they were not nicely formed. In the next week or so I will take Maverick back for a re-check on his Cobalamin and Folate levels.

      If it's OK with our vet, I'd like to just keep him on the B12 and Folic Acid as a preventative measure. Also if it is OK, I'd like to reintroduce the Fish Oil.

      Maverick's coat still looks like crap, but he's shedding heavily and has been for 6 or so weeks. Bear is shedding too, but he's almost done. It's very noticeable that Maverick has a much thicker and heavier coat. I'm hoping that my continued brushing will eventually help the texture. The appearance is getting nicer looking, but is still extremely coarse and dry. I hope that if I can resume the Fish Oil that will help a little.

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