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    1. #1
      Puppy
      seattle lab's Avatar
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      Dog possibly at stud and I'm new to breeding

      Hello,

      New member here and hoping for some help. I've been approached to have my BLM stud a litter and I'm just now realizing that it's not nearly as simple as I initially thought (the actual process and logistics). I spoke with a few experienced retriever folks (breeders) and they clued me into the whole process but not all off it processed so I'm here to try and do my dudiligence and decide if this is an endeavor I'd like to take on.

      My boy has almost all of his health clearances. I need to have an echo done and probably redo his eyes for this year. Other than that and possibly testing if he carries yellow or chocolate not much to do in that regard. He's in his prime so I'm told for breeding as far as age. He turned 3 this past Feb. Plans are to breed in Nov. If all works out.

      I've developed a stud contract using some other folk's that are online. I'm mostly daunted by the prospect of the little details that go into getting a successful tye or 2. As I understand it the bitch will come to me and I'm responsible for them doing the deed as projesterone levels dictate the timing being right.

      I guess I'm looking for someone to help me fill in the missing info, that I don't know I don't know, and make any recommendations on how to proceed with where and how to properly educate myself and setting myself up for successfully having a breeding with no injuries.

      Sorry for the long post. Was hoping to clear up initial questions about health clearances etc. Bitch has the main ofa's completed and dna clear by parantage a few clearances missing but we (dam owner) both plan to try and set this litter up for success by crossing our t's and dotting the i's.

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    2. #2
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      seattle lab's Avatar
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      Possible stud request and I'm new to breeding

      Posted this in the welcome wagon but realized probably should go here:

      Hello,

      New member here and hoping for some help. I've been approached to have my BLM stud a litter and I'm just now realizing that it's not nearly as simple as I initially thought (the actual process and logistics). I spoke with a few experienced retriever folks (breeders) and they clued me into the whole process but not all off it processed so I'm here to try and do my dudiligence and decide if this is an endeavor I'd like to take on.

      My boy has almost all of his health clearances. I need to have an echo done and probably redo his eyes for this year. Other than that and possibly testing if he carries yellow or chocolate not much to do in that regard. He's in his prime so I'm told for breeding as far as age. He turned 3 this past Feb. Plans are to breed in Nov. If all works out.

      I've developed a stud contract using some other folk's that are online. I'm mostly daunted by the prospect of the little details that go into getting a successful tye or 2. As I understand it the bitch will come to me and I'm responsible for them doing the deed as projesterone levels dictate the timing being right.

      I guess I'm looking for someone to help me fill in the missing info, that I don't know I don't know, and make any recommendations on how to proceed with where and how to properly educate myself and setting myself up for successfully having a breeding with no injuries.

      Sorry for the long post. Was hoping to clear up initial questions about health clearances etc. Bitch has the main ofa's completed and dna clear by parantage a few clearances missing but we (dam owner) both plan to try and set this litter up for success by crossing our t's and dotting the i's.

      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

    3. #3
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      dxboon's Avatar
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      This board is mostly pet people and not breeders. Those of us who show/trial and/or breed, who are on the board are generally in favor of responsible breeding. For the best outcome for you and the owner of the dam, I would suggest you try to find a mentor or two in the local Labrador clubs. Puget Sound Labrador Retriever Association is a great club in your area: https://www.pslra.org/. If you don’t have a mentor in the breed, you might look into whether a repro vet is local to you to assist. A lot of dogs are not actually bred under live cover now. Like people, dogs can get sexually transmitted diseases which can lead to sterility for the male and problems with the pregnancy for the female.

      Breeding responsibly is not for the faint of heart. There’s really no excuse in this day and age to not get all the clearances recommended by the parent club for the breed on both the sire and dam. Hips and elbows should be graded with passing grades/normal by OFA, TVD is a known heart issue for Labs, and while our understanding of the disorder’s mode of inheritance is not complete, clear echocardiograms for both dam and sire are what we are looking for to try and curtail this issue; your dogs should have an ACVO eye exam yearly; have they both been cleared for EIC, prcd-PRA? These are the health tests the parent club is recommending: Canine Health Information Center: CHIC Information. There are other tests out there that rule out issues like HNPK, which generally is not serious, but I wouldn’t want to produce affected puppies that will mostly get placed in pet homes with people who will have to manage that condition.

      Ultimately, there are a lot of Labradors bred each year. Most, unfortunately, are not bred to any standard or for any purpose — just a bunch of generic black/yellow/brown short-coated, long tailed, drop-eared dogs. If you and the dam’s owner really feel like your dogs are worthy of being bred, please at least do the necessary health clearances.

    4. The Following User Says Thank You to dxboon For This Useful Post:

      windycanyon (05-11-2018)

    5. #4
      Puppy
      seattle lab's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by dxboon View Post
      This board is mostly pet people and not breeders. Those of us who show/trial and/or breed, who are on the board are generally in favor of responsible breeding. For the best outcome for you and the owner of the dam, I would suggest you try to find a mentor or two in the local Labrador clubs. Puget Sound Labrador Retriever Association is a great club in your area: https://www.pslra.org/. If you don’t have a mentor in the breed, you might look into whether a repro vet is local to you to assist. A lot of dogs are not actually bred under live cover now. Like people, dogs can get sexually transmitted diseases which can lead to sterility for the male and problems with the pregnancy for the female.

      Breeding responsibly is not for the faint of heart. There’s really no excuse in this day and age to not get all the clearances recommended by the parent club for the breed on both the sire and dam. Hips and elbows should be graded with passing grades/normal by OFA, TVD is a known heart issue for Labs, and while our understanding of the disorder’s mode of inheritance is not complete, clear echocardiograms for both dam and sire are what we are looking for to try and curtail this issue; your dogs should have an ACVO eye exam yearly; have they both been cleared for EIC, prcd-PRA? These are the health tests the parent club is recommending: Canine Health Information Center: CHIC Information. There are other tests out there that rule out issues like HNPK, which generally is not serious, but I wouldn’t want to produce affected puppies that will mostly get placed in pet homes with people who will have to manage that condition.

      Ultimately, there are a lot of Labradors bred each year. Most, unfortunately, are not bred to any standard or for any purpose — just a bunch of generic black/yellow/brown short-coated, long tailed, drop-eared dogs. If you and the dam’s owner really feel like your dogs are worthy of being bred, please at least do the necessary health clearances.
      I feel that both dogs have prooven their validity in competition and will have prooven health clearances prior to breeding.

      As I mentioned my boy has the following clearances registered with OFA.

      Hips - Excellent
      Elbows - Normal
      Eyes - Normal (as of Sept. 2017) plan to update in Sept of 2018
      Heart - Normal, but did not do an echo as I wasn't planning to breed at that time. Will update with echo prior to breeding.
      EIC - Clear
      PRA - Clear
      CNM - Clear
      D Locus - Clear

      Dams clearances:

      Hips - Good
      Elbows - Normal
      Eyes - Normal (as of Oct. 2017)
      EIC, PRA and CNM - clear by parantage
      Dam owner plans to do full color testing including D Locus and heart echo prior to breeding.

      I believe that covers all off the parent breed testing that is generally recommended.

      As far as bettering the breed, both dogs are amateur trained AKC Master Hunters. Both are qualified to run and will run in the 2018 Master National in Roseburg, OR.

      My BLM has achieved his AKC Senior and Master Titles with only one failed test, a Senior. He just passed his 7th straight Master Test this past weekend at the PSLRA HT. Additionally he is one pass away from his UKC Finished Title and already has his Seasoned Title with no failures in UKC.

      Both dogs are hunted each fall/winter as I believe the breed was intended to and have demonstrated they excel in natural drive and athleticism. As I mentioned earlier both dogs have been 100% amateur trained and I think that demonstrates both of their trainability. This is my first time training a retriever and I think that also speaks highly to my boys trainability.

      The Dam's pedigree is an MH x MH with a paternal Grandfather being GRHRCH and MNH under a prolific Pro trainer that has been bred significantly. My boy is FC/AFC Sire x MH Dam, with the Dam's parents being NAFC x NFC. My boy also has 3 full siblings with QAA placements. One of which is QAA2 with 2 1sts and 25 derby points and is now running all age stakes.

      Thank you for the recommendations to find a mentor. I think that would make me much more comfortable with the Stud process. When I spoke with the previously mentioned breeders they kind of opened my eyes to what typically happens during a breeding and that was a little daunting. I was hoping there would be more experienced breeders on the forum and hopefully those or anyone with additional suggestions will chime in.

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    6. #5
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      barry581's Avatar
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      Welcome to the board! While I am not a breeder, it does sound like you are on the right track regarding clearances, which are extremely important. Here is a link regarding clearances posted on this board in case you didn't see it. Clearances For Labs

      If you have any specific questions you can post them here: General Health Issues You may get more responses there!

    7. #6
      Chief Pooper Scooper
      JenC's Avatar
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      Get your post count up and if you want, PM me. I've been going through my stud contract recently and have refined a few areas. We just studded out our boy Jagger last week. So this is all fresh in my mind.

      One thing I can tell you is that I find a lot of bitch owners don't have a clue unless you are dealing with someone pretty seasoned. And the folks I just dealt with, even though they've been breeding longer than I have owned labs, they needed some educating too.

      BTW-I'm going to move this thread out of the Welcome Wagon. Probably to the Health area.

    8. #7
      Chief Pooper Scooper
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      I merged your 2 threads. We only need one. We have moderators who can help if a post ends up in the wrong place! LOL (ME for one).

    9. #8
      Puppy
      seattle lab's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by JenC View Post
      I merged your 2 threads. We only need one. We have moderators who can help if a post ends up in the wrong place! LOL (ME for one).
      Thanks for getting my post to the right place!!!

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    10. #9
      Puppy
      seattle lab's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by JenC View Post
      Get your post count up and if you want, PM me. I've been going through my stud contract recently and have refined a few areas. We just studded out our boy Jagger last week. So this is all fresh in my mind.

      One thing I can tell you is that I find a lot of bitch owners don't have a clue unless you are dealing with someone pretty seasoned. And the folks I just dealt with, even though they've been breeding longer than I have owned labs, they needed some educating too.

      BTW-I'm going to move this thread out of the Welcome Wagon. Probably to the Health area.
      So is this kind of how the process goes?

      1 - prior to heat cycle dogs are introduced a few times.
      2- bitch goes into heat and owners bring to me.
      3- progesterone testing to determine when ovulation happens
      4 - progesterone at a 5 then try for a tye or 2.
      5 - try for another tye every other day until bitch comes out of heat.
      6 - bitch goes home.

      Just trying to wrap my head around all the steps.

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    11. #10
      Chief Pooper Scooper
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      1 - prior to heat cycle dogs are introduced a few times. *not necessarily necessary. If you are able to do this, great.
      2- bitch goes into heat and owners bring to me. *if you want. I don't have the facilities to keep an intact bitch at my house. I'd have the owners tell you and they would keep the bitch at their house.
      3- progesterone testing to determine when ovulation happens *bitch owner should be doing this. They keep their girl, do the testing and when she hits 5 ng then you get involved.
      4 - progesterone at a 5 then try for a tye or 2. *when progesterone hits 5, she should be ready for breeding on day 2 and day 4 after 5 ng, but you may want to do another progesterone to make sure she is rising appropriately.
      5 - try for another tye every other day until bitch comes out of heat. *once progesterone gets too high, there is no point in breeding through the end of the cycle. 2 or 3 covers should be sufficient.
      6 - bitch goes home.

      There is a ton of info on how to time breeding through progesterone testing on the internet. Google it. I just went through this as the bitch owner (I had the dog, but I wasn't going to do naturals, instead did side by side AIs) and then a week later as the stud owner. I can't keep the bitch at my house, so I drove the hour 3 times to them.

      And making sure the bitch is ready is the responsibility of the bitch owner. Do not make this more difficult for yourself. Unless you are working in a sufficient price for your time and effort, the bitch owner should be on top of the testing, informing you when the need the male, etc.

      You should also get familiar with collecting your boy and how to perform and AI. If the dogs do not want to do the deed, or cannot due to a size incompatibility, you need to be able to step in. The bitch my boy bred, while she was at the right numbers, and my boy tried to do it naturally, she was not as willing as she should have been. The humping was fine, but she was totally against the tie. I had to jump in and do the AI.

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