Not coming the whole way back

[teej89]

Alright so as of a week ago Boomer (4.5mo) gets his mark, brings it back and stops 5yds short of me no matter how much I hoot and cheer him on and he sits down and looks at the next winger for his next mark. Can't do squat he just sits there. We did water retrieves yesterday and as soon as he gets outta the water I start backing away cheering him on and he gets out comes bout 5' off the shore turns around and sits down waiting for his next mark.

I think this started because we extended his marks recently and he may be tired? We started the firedrill a 2 weeks ago and now he's running 80yd marks without any assistance from the thrower. He lined a 150yd mark yesterday(without any help) hunted for maybe 20sec before finding it, came the whole way back then plopped his butt down 5yds short of me and looked for the next mark. I gave up hooting at him and we had 2 more wingers to run but I just turned around and walked away to make him follow me which he did eventually.

Anything else I can do? It'd be wrong to go to him and get the bumper and let him run again correct?

[Snowshoe]

That's when North South fetching helped me. Not quite the same problem as me but close enough this might help you.

Snowshoe's Album: North/South Fetch

I should note, due to family situations with me and the trainer, (both our elderly Mum's sick and his died) we did not continue with this training. All I wanted was to get a Working Certificate but stuff just happened and we didn't. It still works though, the N/S.

[teej89]

That's when North South fetching helped me. Not quite the same problem as me but close enough this might help you.

Snowshoe's Album: North/South Fetch

I should note, due to family situations with me and the trainer, (both our elderly Mum's sick and his died) we did not continue with this training. All I wanted was to get a Working Certificate but stuff just happened and we didn't. It still works though, the N/S.

Thanks! And yeah he's coming back but the last 2% of the run he's like ehhhh I'm gonna sit cuz I know there's another out there for me. I may try and do a play off the n/s for when he's coming back. Going back out today so we'll see how he does if it's the same thing I'm going to have to start something.

[Anna Scott]

Your pup is in his teenage stage and is working for himself and not for you. He gets the retrieve and comes to where he wants to be because he thinks he is going to get the gratification of another mark. You are right don't go to him and take the bumper and certainly don't let him have another retrieve. I would disappear off line when he doesn't come to you. When we start pups the coming in is more important than the going out. The retrieving is the natural instinct bringing the bumper or bird to hand is the trained response. We always carry an extra bumper that we use to lure the pup back to us. We really don't care if he drops the one he has as long as he comes back to us. I would go back to short retrieves and a long line to make sure he knows that the delivery to hand is the correct behavior. He is only 4.5 months so you have some time to work with his hand delivery before make any other decisions

[teej89]

Thanks Anne! I honestly just think he's tired after the long marks. The shorter ones he'll come back to hand. But yeah i'm going to start ignoring him and walking away if he keeps it up.

[IRISHWISTLER]

Teej89,
BOOMER is quite young so don't push too hard, it could be related to dental issues (new teeth coming in). After he turns 6 plus months old and gets his permanent teeth in, ye can get more demanding as time moves forward. consider working BOOMER from a PLACE PLATFORM which offers a retriever a concrete position in space from which to start and and finish a retrieve. It can also help in lining the dog up to "HEEL' at the lssue of the command "PLACE"


The "PLACE" platform serves as a starting and end point of the retrieve, lessens confusion for the dog in that regard, and helps to line the dog up prior to being sent to make a retrieve. I use one as a very effective tool in the formation of proper mechanics of the retrieve including coming to SIT at HEEL and delivery to hand. You could throw a few short bumpers while BOOMER is on the end of a check cord and guide him in and onto the PLACE PLATFORM. I first instill the "PLACE" command with the desired behavior as a part of routine training for the dog. A far away retrieve is less than desireable in starting with this method. Not sure if BOOMER is collar conditioned, but if so it can be of help in the establishmemt of the "PLACE" command. Your OB needs to be solid and it sounds like BOOMER needs further work on "RECALL" (HERE). You could use your recall command when he had item to be retrieved and chain it to the "PLACE" command as he gets in closer, guiding him with a check cord onto the platform. Only let him retrieve 20 - 30% of the bumpers thrown to build both desire and steadyness. Use the power of the retrieve as a reward and only provide additional retrieves when he returns all the way to the "PLACE" platform. Consider providing "FORCE FETCH" training at about 7 months of age and it should solidify a complete retrieve to hand.

Good luck with BOOMER!

Cheers,
Irishwhistler

[Snowshoe]

Oh, sorry, I missed that he's so young. Our trainer was throwing lots of tennis balls though, even when his pup was young. His pup was two months younger than mine. But at the early ages he just wanted the pup to think going and getting a ball was fun. LOL, his pup used to throw her own balls for herself. Really, she'd put her foot over the ball on the paved driveway and push till it popped out, she'd race after it, bring it back to the driveway and do it again.

[teej89]

Awesome thanks so much Irishwhistler! He is teething right now, doesn't seem to affect his drive all that much tho. I'm going to build one of these platforms tonight and get to working on "place" I'm going to use "kennel" though.

So you're saying once he has place down, set him on there with long lead in hand and have someone toss bumpers (he doesn't break if I throw it). Have them throw 6 but let him get say the 3rd and 6th bumper that was thrown?

I started with the Hillmann routine and I veered from it because I'm going to go to Lardy. The thing is when doing OB training he knows here and listens everytime. How do I solidify "here" else wise? Right now I tell him to sit and walk away from him or do a circle around him until I finally say here then he comes to me and I tell him to sit right as he gets to me and he sits facing me.

[IRISHWISTLER]

TEEJ89

Throw singles (short) so ye can control his return with the check cord. Only one bumper out on any one retrieve. If are working steadying, throw upward of 10 with yourself or an assistant picking up 7 or 8 of them. Only send him on singles and reinforce delivery to hand (or even the increment of returning all the way to "PLACE" whilst carrying the bumper.

Remember, your pup is still very young and teething (mouth issues are not uncommon at this period in Boomer's development).

Ye have plenty o' time, relax and keep the pressure low on BOOMER and yeself.

Slan go foill,
Irishwhistler

[windycanyon]

Sorry if I missed it, but are you just standing there, expecting him to bring to you? With pups, I am always encouraging them to bring it back to hand by turning and doing a little run away from puppy. Puppies love that chase game, so once up along side of pup, you reach out and get the bumper/ bird. I do a lot of short little fun bumpers (or birds) to create the desire to bring to hand ... ie, if I take to mom/dad, he/ she will throw it again!
Once that is ingrained, I transition to what Anna posted using another bumper/bird etc to encourage the pup all the way.