What I want to do vrs what I ought to do

[TuMicks]

At the end of the active group training season, Rocket Dog was doing everything you'd want a Senior Dog to do and doing it with style. (I'm not saying I was doing that well as a handler, but she was certainly doing what you'd want her to do.) So I wanted to begin the Hunt Test season running the Senior stakes and by the end of the season be running with the big dogs.

But... I also want to get my judging credentials. My pro believes (and I suspect she is right) that I need to title Rocket Dog as a Junior Hunter, since that's where judges begin their apprenticing. (The book says that an apprentice judge only has to get one Junior orange... but the feeling is that that would not really teach me the subtleties of judging Junior dogs and I should run at least 4 before I apprentice.)

Bummer. So I guess I'll be running Junior at Norcal in March.

[Labradorks]

At the end of the active group training season, Rocket Dog was doing everything you'd want a Senior Dog to do and doing it with style. (I'm not saying I was doing that well as a handler, but she was certainly doing what you'd want her to do.) So I wanted to begin the Hunt Test season running the Senior stakes and by the end of the season be running with the big dogs.

But... I also want to get my judging credentials. My pro believes (and I suspect she is right) that I need to title Rocket Dog as a Junior Hunter, since that's where judges begin their apprenticing. (The book says that an apprentice judge only has to get one Junior orange... but the feeling is that that would not really teach me the subtleties of judging Junior dogs and I should run at least 4 before I apprentice.)

Bummer. So I guess I'll be running Junior at Norcal in March.

Is the NorCal one White something or other or Glide?

Have you run there before? I was told over the weekend from a few Lab Club members that the "one in northern California" had a really difficult water entry. I don't know what that means though...

There is a double-header here over Memorial Day weekend! I think I'm going to that one to start the season.

[IRISHWISTLER]

Have you run there before? I was told over the weekend from a few Lab Club members that the "one in northern California" had a really difficult water entry. I don't know what that means though...
There is a double-header here over Memorial Day weekend! I think I'm going to that one to start the season.

TRAD at 10 months of age whilst training for his AKC JH.

Difficult water entry is a relative term. What one handler / retriever team finds to be difficult, another will not. If a large percentage of those handler / dog teams find that the test is "meaty", it probably is.

A difficult water entry can present in a number of ways. Steep embankments, deep water, vegetation or obstacle at point of entry all come to mind and could be very challenging for dogs that have not trained to meet those demands. The line being a distance from the point of entry to the water thus requiring the handler to send the dog across land to enter the water can also be a challenge for some handler dog teams that have not trained on those skills.

Judges pre-screen the test for safety hazards and eliminate any perceived ahead of time. Though some judges have a reputation for running challenging tests, most all will keep the test within the parameters set forth in the rules and might still set up a challenging or "meaty" test. It seems that handlers that handle a dog through such "meaty" tests find it to be particularly satisfying when they have done so.

A good strategy is to train to the level of the stake above that which your dog will be running in. Good luck in your hunt tests.

Cheers,
Irishwhistler

[TuMicks]

NorCal is in Suisun City, CA on March 19th. Darn it... I wish there were more HT's around N. Cal. or Oregon in March. I've never attended this particular trial or seen their grounds. But my training partners have and there will be people from around here attending (though probably not at the Junior.)

I can tell you a Junior scenario that just ate up the dogs of all my friends when they were running that stake. These were/are great dogs. But on the "simple" land single, the judges had the birds thrown in, instead of back. We always want our dogs to drive and never hunt short. So we pretty much don't train for throws that go in toward the line. But this judge thought it would be easier for the dogs or something. Sure enough... all of the dogs in our training group had to be handled to the mark after they blew past it or they would have driven to the next county.

Come to think of it, Rocket Dog will be over-running (swimming) things in the junior if we don't do some short stuff in training. I like the idea of working on singles. She's never been a head swinger, and she's got a good memory, but I think doing singles will only help her.

I would like to attend the HT on Memorial Day weekend in Portland. It's usually on Suavie Island. I have been to that one before. But we wouldn't run the double header. Too much of a good thing and RD will come unhinged.

A friend of mine who did her apprenticeship last year said that judging the junior was like watching a retriever rodeo. So few of the dogs had any line manners at all. (Yes, you can bring your dog to line on a slip lead... but they're supposed to be walking at heel.)

[IRISHWISTLER]

NorCal is in Suisun City, CA on March 19th. Darn it... I wish there were more HT's around N. Cal. or Oregon in March. I've never attended this particular trial or seen their grounds. But my training partners have and there will be people from around here attending (though probably not at the Junior.)

There is an adage that says that whatever your dog can do on land is markedly harder for him to do in water. End of story. Water complicates things a lot for the dog. So for a junior dog a "simple" water single is all about marking the bird, getting in the water, remembering where the bird is and bringing it to the handler. I don't think judges should have gunners throwing ducks into tules or have dogs going water land water.

I can tell you a Junior scenario that just ate up the dogs of all my friends when they were running that stake. These were/are great dogs. But on the "simple" land single, the judges had the birds thrown in, instead of back. We always want our dogs to drive and never hunt short. So we pretty much don't train for throws that go in toward the line. But this judge thought it would be easier for the dogs or something. Sure enough... all of the dogs in our training group had to be handled to the mark after they blew past it or they would have driven to the next county.
Come to think of it, Rocket Dog will be over-running (swimming) things in the junior if we don't do some short stuff in training. I like the idea of working on singles. She's never been a head swinger, and she's got a good memory, but I think doing singles will only help her.

I would like to attend the HT on Memorial Day weekend in Portland. It's usually on Suavie Island. I have been to that one before. But we wouldn't run the double header. Too much of a good thing and RD will come unhinged.

I have seen JH tests where "the line" is not near the edge of the water, and I have surely seen birds hand tossed into the tules (not the norm but not unheard of). Marking is the focus. A dog must deliver to hand. A handler that makes the decision to "handle" his / her dog must do so all the way to the bird once they havd initiated the handle. These seem to be the most common problem areas in the JH stakes.

Irishwhistler

[Labradorks]

NorCal is in Suisun City, CA on March 19th. Darn it... I wish there were more HT's around N. Cal. or Oregon in March. I've never attended this particular trial or seen their grounds. But my training partners have and there will be people from around here attending (though probably not at the Junior.)

I can tell you a Junior scenario that just ate up the dogs of all my friends when they were running that stake. These were/are great dogs. But on the "simple" land single, the judges had the birds thrown in, instead of back. We always want our dogs to drive and never hunt short. So we pretty much don't train for throws that go in toward the line. But this judge thought it would be easier for the dogs or something. Sure enough... all of the dogs in our training group had to be handled to the mark after they blew past it or they would have driven to the next county.

Come to think of it, Rocket Dog will be over-running (swimming) things in the junior if we don't do some short stuff in training. I like the idea of working on singles. She's never been a head swinger, and she's got a good memory, but I think doing singles will only help her.

I would like to attend the HT on Memorial Day weekend in Portland. It's usually on Suavie Island. I have been to that one before. But we wouldn't run the double header. Too much of a good thing and RD will come unhinged.

A friend of mine who did her apprenticeship last year said that judging the junior was like watching a retriever rodeo. So few of the dogs had any line manners at all. (Yes, you can bring your dog to line on a slip lead... but they're supposed to be walking at heel.)

There should be plenty of water on the island during Memorial Day weekend. Our club's HT is in July and last year it was like a mud puddle (we had a 100% pass rate for juniors at that test last year)! I will be at that one, too, regardless of where we are by then, in support of the club. I'd like to go to a test at St. Louis Ponds this year, too.

[TuMicks]

I have seen JH tests where "the line" is not near the edge of the water, and I have surely seen birds hand tossed into the tules (not the norm but not unheard of). Marking is the focus. A dog must deliver to hand. A handler that makes the decision to "handle" his / her dog must do so all the way to the bird once they havd initiated the handle. These seem to be the most common problem areas in the JH stakes.

Irishwhistler

When the incident occurred with the inward throw, I'm sure my friends were trying to handle all the way to the bird, and their dogs were out of transition, but still young and maybe they weren't the cleanest handles in the world. I think that was the bird that they all went out on. (Even so, we still don't throw birds inward in training.)

With regard to Junior, what elements and entries have you seen used particularly well? (I mean, on the one hand, Junior is not about toughness and courage in cover and obstacles, but we don't do Junior tests on golf courses either.) Just curious.

[TuMicks]

There should be plenty of water on the island during Memorial Day weekend. Our club's HT is in July and last year it was like a mud puddle (we had a 100% pass rate for juniors at that test last year)! I will be at that one, too, regardless of where we are by then, in support of the club. I'd like to go to a test at St. Louis Ponds this year, too.

Where is that?

[Labradorks]

Where is that?

Gervis, Oregon. Off I-5, South of Portland.

[windycanyon]

Ehhh, you have to apprentice judge first, so you are going to get a feel there too--- but yes, it's nice to have marshaled and run (imo) several dogs at JH before judging at JH.

Inward throws (sometimes unavoidable w/ live flyers and we tend to get 2 live flyers whenever possible up here in WA), water set ups that encourage cheating, steep terrain or dangerous water entries (the latter 2 are my real bitches w/ JH judges as we train the inward, backward and lateral throws!!!) are all things to watch out for. I've run several dogs as test dogs at JH to *SEE* the problems before my girl even ran. Thank GOD for test dogs!!! (I always try to bring one or 2 who are qualified to run as set up and / or test dogs for that reason... I don't want my youngsters to run a dangerous test as they are almost always <2 yrs old and not OFA'd yet... sure as heck don't want to invite injuries).

Shoot, you want to borrow a couple pups???? I so desperately want and need to get back to training but have a litter of *12* here and possibly another litter in the plans for the spring. Sigh.