Sleeping issues

Hi al

Been a long time I've been on here, but I come with an issue that I have with my second Lab, Linus.

He's 15 months old and very attached to my older Lab, and his sister, Marcie, who's 5 1/2.

The issue I have is that he is and has been a very snuggly puppy. He came from a small litter of 2 and since a baby is needy of physical contact. So what I'm finding since I got him is his need to sleep very close to Marcie on their bed, which is in my bedroom. So much so that it annoys her, as she likes her space when sleeping. So I find that at night, he plonks right next to her and she gets up and sleeps on the couch in the living room. He follows and sleeps with her on the couch. She will then potentially switch back and forth between couch and bed with him in tow.

I've had a behaviourist suggest a few things: supper at night to settle him, a warm mat under their bed cover, Adaptil spray. None of these seem to work, as really he just not happy unless closely snuggled with Marcie or myself - which I don't allow at night.

Should I be looking at crating him? I hate to think that I'm going to deprive him of that closeness he needs, as that just seems part of his nature, but then I also know that Marcie needs her space to sleep without being annoyed all night. Any other suggestions?

Thank in advance everyone!

Welcome/back!

How about putting his crate next to her bed?

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Originally Posted by SunDance

Welcome/back!

How about putting his crate next to her bed?

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That would be my suggestion too.

He's not crated. They share a large bed together. Should I crate him?

That's probably the only way you can keep him from moving back and forth with her right now without closing the bedroom door and keeping one of the dogs outside of the room and the other inside. Then you'd have the issue of Marcie being unhappy because she's accustomed to sleeping in your bedroom if she's the one who is out or Linus being unhappy because he's out there by himself and might then decide to get into mischief. Has he been crated trained at all yet? If so, you could put his crate beside the dog bed or on your side of the bed, if there's room. When I get new puppies, they sleep in their crate but it's right beside me on my side of the bed so if they whimper or whine, I can reach down and let them know I'm right there.

Our first lab was a bit aloof when it came to snuggling when we got a new puppy when he was about 6 years old. Lark learned that she'd be OK not sleeping right up against him- like Marcie, Chase would just get up and move. Of course, he'd go sleep in another room from where we were sitting even before we got the puppy. My current 2 don't sleep touching each other during the day, but they are usually within a couple of feet of each other. The younger one (10 months old) has slept over night in a crate since we got him.

As a side project, have you taken Linus to any classes or does he do any activities without Marcie being along? I'm just wondering if it would be beneficial to him to get some more experience doing things independently- obedience classes, nose work, rally or something that might make him feel more confident just by himself. Not that Marcie is old or sick, but should something devastating happen to her, it might be good if he felt more confident in general, if you think maybe he doesn't.

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Originally Posted by smartrock

That's probably the only way you can keep him from moving back and forth with her right now without closing the bedroom door and keeping one of the dogs outside of the room and the other inside. Then you'd have the issue of Marcie being unhappy because she's accustomed to sleeping in your bedroom if she's the one who is out or Linus being unhappy because he's out there by himself and might then decide to get into mischief. Has he been crated trained at all yet? If so, you could put his crate beside the dog bed or on your side of the bed, if there's room. When I get new puppies, they sleep in their crate but it's right beside me on my side of the bed so if they whimper or whine, I can reach down and let them know I'm right there.

Our first lab was a bit aloof when it came to snuggling when we got a new puppy when he was about 6 years old. Lark learned that she'd be OK not sleeping right up against him- like Marcie, Chase would just get up and move. Of course, he'd go sleep in another room from where we were sitting even before we got the puppy. My current 2 don't sleep touching each other during the day, but they are usually within a couple of feet of each other. The younger one (10 months old) has slept over night in a crate since we got him.

As a side project, have you taken Linus to any classes or does he do any activities without Marcie being along? I'm just wondering if it would be beneficial to him to get some more experience doing things independently- obedience classes, nose work, rally or something that might make him feel more confident just by himself. Not that Marcie is old or sick, but should something devastating happen to her, it might be good if he felt more confident in general, if you think maybe he doesn't.

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Hi Smartrock. Thank you so much for the response. The behaviourist suggested the same regarding activities without Marcie. So I try to take him for a walk around the block while she has a treat at home, or vice versa. Just to get him used to the idea that it's OK without her. I've never crated any of my dogs in the past. They've all been good on their bed without any issues. He seems more dependent than any of the others. And like you said, the behaviourist also said he needs to get used to being without her at times as she won't be here forever, and he'd have to be medicated for the depression he'd suffer if he was to continue this way. And we don't want that.

I think crating might be the next step here, as he really doesn't look like changing this behaviour. Is this done with crate door closed? I just worry about the need to go out to potty.

So, if Linus hasn't been crate trained so that he is familiar with and comfortable in a crate, you'll have to back to the beginning and start slowly getting him accustomed to being in a crate at all before just putting him in and closing the door. I start as soon as I bring a puppy home except our first pups who we didn't crate train until they were probably Linus's age. This was long ago and before you could look all this info up online so I'm not sure we trained them as methodically as we probably should have. But they quickly adjusted to their crates. They were litter mates and pretty bonded to each other, too. We put their crates side by side and they stayed there during the day while we were at work because they were chewing the kitchen cabinets, door frames, tearing up sofa cushions, etc. Anyway, now you can look up recommendations for crate training puppies or dogs. Here's one article to get you started. As you can see, it may take several weeks before he's fully comfortable in a crate. I wouldn't put him in a crate and shut the door without some more gradual introduction if he's not already crate trained. Crate Training Adult Dog Guide 2019 [Solving Common Pet Cage Issues]

I like that my dogs are comfortable in crates. As young pups, I know there's a safe place they can stay if I work, if I'm showering, grocery shopping, or otherwise away from the house. Also, should they need to stay overnight at the vet's for some health problem, they are already accustomed to a crate and having to be in one at the vet doesn't add another stressor to the experience. If we travel and have to stay in a hotel or with relatives, they can comfortably rest in their crates if the situation warrants.

What happens if he needs to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night now? At 15 months of age he should be mature enough to go without a potty break overnight as long as he isn't ill. Make sure he goes outside and actually goes right before bedtime, even if it means leashing him up and taking him for a short walk. If his crate is in your bedroom and he has to go potty in the middle of the night, hopefully he'll whine or somehow let you know he needs to go outside. I've had 8 dogs from puppies, and generally by 4 months or sometimes younger, they can sleep through the night without a potty break.

I hope you find some ideas that work for you. It sounds sweet that Linus is so cuddly but I can understand you wanting him to be OK if he isn't cuddled up. Good luck!

I started Asher out in a crate as a pup. Essential for me since I work during the day. I had another crate in the bedroom at night. Samson would NOT allow the little guy to sleep on the bed with us. Samson would over react and jump up, growl, and get as far away from little Asher as possible. Asher was just fine in the crate beside the bed. I would think if you introduced him to the crate like Smartrock suggests, it may work. Place the crate right beside Marcie's bed. I am happy to say that Samson finally approved of Asher on the bed after about a year. We were on a trip in the Outer banks last Easter and I let Asher sleep in the bed. Samson didn't object. When we got home I thought I'd try and again, Samson was fine. Not sure what changed with the big guy but I was happy he finally accepted Asher. Wasn't just isolated to the bed....in general, Samson didn't want Asher laying near him.. The two guys are best friends now.