Show bred lab Hunting?

[Baron]

Hello all im new to the forum.
I have a 10 month old labrador from very good "Show lines". I have recently become interested in wingshooting or just as i got my puppy. He has been obedience trained and is not gun shy. Started introducing him to loud noises from a young age and it has worked perfectly.

Have a few training dummies which he retrieves when told and brings back to hand.He is great with water retrieves and shakes on command. And even retrieves blinds. I was at a farm recently and my friend shot a bird over his German shorthaired pointer. I then told Baron to fetch as he marked it and of he went he found the bird with no problem but did not want to pick it up. I played around with the bird and he soon became excited and was carrying it around and bringing it to hand.

We then threw the bird into cover and he was keen on retrieving every time at full speed and very excited. Even water retrieves he nailed. While tossing the bird into cover or into water we shot the 12gauge and the gun doesnt bother him at all. I believe he will make a great waterdog even though he is from a show bred line.

But the question is will i be able to train him to hunt upland bird?Because when we are walking he always stays right at my side and never ranges. I want him to range in front but not to far and flush birds. Is it possible and how do i go about training him to do it? Would love him to follow scent and flush birds.

If i could i would have bought a field trial bred dog but too late now. Sorry for long post but thought i should just put in some history.

[Dwayne]

I have a highly bred Dickendall show dog. Sold to me from a close friend. I don't show him - I hunt with him. Granted - I don't quail or upland hunt with him only because I don't have the opportunity. I'm sure he could do it if I trained him. I duck, squirrel, and antler hunt with him. Now, he won't range too far away from me unless he smells something he knows he is supposed to be hunting. Otherwise, when I release him, he quarters in front of me 20-30 yards. I didn't teach him to quarter - I did teach him to "hunt 'em up" or release from heel/sit and go find what I tell him to. He understands the words duck, squirrel, and horns and differentiates them. If I'm duck hunting - he won't go chasing squirrels even if they come down on the bank in full view a few feet away from him.

I once took my son on a guided Pheasant hunt. The guide went to his dog boxes on his truck to release his dog for our hunt. My son and I expected to see him release a GSP or some other pointy dog. To our surprise - out jumps a black lab. That lab hunted, pointed, and retrieved all day long just as pretty as you please. I asked the guide why he didn't hunt with a GSP and he said, "I don't have one. I do have a lab. I guess I would if I had one, but I don't. I've had some pointers, some good and some not so good. This guy's as good as any of them, so I hunt him."

I guess what I'm saying is, don't sell him short for hunting because his pedigree says he's a show dog or his breed says he's a retriever and not a pointer. Try him out at it, you might be surprised!

[windycanyon]

Originally Posted by Baron

But the question is will i be able to train him to hunt upland bird?Because when we are walking he always stays right at my side and never ranges. I want him to range in front but not to far and flush birds. Is it possible and how do i go about training him to do it? Would love him to follow scent and flush birds.

The easiest way to get a pup to range in front is to take him on a few "walks" with seasoned dogs. All of my pups catch on very quickly just by trailing my older dogs who love to work the brush and flush out quail, etc. around here. I have to work a little harder when I take the whole pack (6) for walks as they will tend to range further than I'd like but in hunting situations, it's not that tough to keep them in closer as we only will take one at a time. There are plenty of "show" lines that hunt quite nicely, btw! Good luck and have fun. Anne

[CanyonLabradors]

Sure you can train the dog.

The litter I bred last year was bred for the intention of me keeping something back to show. I sold the pup with the most retrieving instinct to a guy who wanted to do hunting tests, and his dog already earned his UKC Started Hunting Retriever title at 16 months.

[Annette47]

Originally Posted by CanyonLabradors

Sure you can train the dog.

The litter I bred last year was bred for the intention of me keeping something back to show. I sold the pup with the most retrieving instinct to a guy who wanted to do hunting tests, and his dog already earned his UKC Started Hunting Retriever title at 16 months.

My male's father was from completely show-bred lines and at the time (years ago of course!) was the youngest dog in the history of the breed to earn his MH.

[uplander]

Get this book...on sale from Gun Dog supplies...

I've read a few books, DVDs from Gun Dog magazine , but this book is the best I've come across.....

Tom Dokkens ...Retriever Training.....($14.95 )

http://www.gundogsupply.com/tom-dokk...ning-book.html

Your " Show " bred Labrador has the instincts....now you have to train him...He will be in the type of a "Gentlemans" Gun dog....will not be as hyped up as a field bred Lab...But everytime he gets to experience "Live " birds he is going to want into the game...it is fun for them.

My Lab is as " Show " bred as they come (also a Dickendall like above poster )..... and it is his second season pheasant hunting ...He loves it....

[Fowl Play]

Originally Posted by windycanyon

The easiest way to get a pup to range in front is to take him on a few "walks" with seasoned dogs. All of my pups catch on very quickly just by trailing my older dogs who love to work the brush and flush out quail, etc. around here. I have to work a little harder when I take the whole pack (6) for walks as they will tend to range further than I'd like but in hunting situations, it's not that tough to keep them in closer as we only will take one at a time. There are plenty of "show" lines that hunt quite nicely, btw! Good luck and have fun. Anne

It's amazing how much a trained dog can teach a pup. That's how we got Gunner to go mad about bumpers, and about birds. He was hesitant at first about both, but once Stryke took off, Gunner had to follow. Like you, when alone, both of my dogs stick in close, but when they're together, or with my dad's Springers, they go out a lot farther. Since all 4 are well trained on the whistle recall, letting them go out farther is no worry for me.

[Baron]

I had a amazing weekend. I went to my brother in law's farm. And he has a GSP and a Cocker Spaniel. I asked him if i could take Baron and his spaniel for a walk because he has a flushing spaniel.The idea behind it was i wanted him to learn by example. And so that he can realize which smell he should be looking for.

Baron went with the spaniel but soon was just ranging infront of me and the spaniel just out of sight because of the heavy brush. The spaniel now and then crossed with us and it was perfect timing because just when he crossed infront of me he got interested in a bush just to my left. Baron went after the spaniel and just when he got there the spaniel flushed 4-5 pheasnts.

The spaniel chased and Baron also. That is where he clicked what he should be looking for! For the rest af the walk which lasted a hour there where about another 10 birds flushed some of them by Baron. We then rested and in the late afternoon i took just Baron to see what would happen.

I said hunt em up just like i used for the spaniel and he started working his nose. Ranging infront of me from side to side. Then i got this great feeling.
Not ten minutes later he flushed a bird and very happy about himself. And for the rest of the walk another few. And while getting more confidence and ranging a bit further everytime.

Love it when things just start to fall in place. Thanks for the replies.

P.S. Last night when it was time to call it a weekend. We where on our way home and just before exiting the farm 3 pheasants crossed over the road just infront into a beautiful grassfield. Baron didnt see them but i just had to let him out. Me still sitting in the car told him 'hunt em up' and he started working. He worked the field and about 50 yards in flushed all of them.

Cant wait for the hunting season to start!

[Annette47]

Originally Posted by Baron

I had a amazing weekend. I went to my brother in law's farm. And he has a GSP and a Cocker Spaniel. I asked him if i could take Baron and his spaniel for a walk because he has a flushing spaniel.The idea behind it was i wanted him to learn by example. And so that he can realize which smell he should be looking for.

Baron went with the spaniel but soon was just ranging infront of me and the spaniel just out of sight because of the heavy brush. The spaniel now and then crossed with us and it was perfect timing because just when he crossed infront of me he got interested in a bush just to my left. Baron went after the spaniel and just when he got there the spaniel flushed 4-5 pheasnts.

The spaniel chased and Baron also. That is where he clicked what he should be looking for! For the rest af the walk which lasted a hour there where about another 10 birds flushed some of them by Baron. We then rested and in the late afternoon i took just Baron to see what would happen.

I said hunt em up just like i used for the spaniel and he started working his nose. Ranging infront of me from side to side. Then i got this great feeling.
Not ten minutes later he flushed a bird and very happy about himself. And for the rest of the walk another few. And while getting more confidence and ranging a bit further everytime.

Love it when things just start to fall in place. Thanks for the replies.

P.S. Last night when it was time to call it a weekend. We where on our way home and just before exiting the farm 3 pheasants crossed over the road just infront into a beautiful grassfield. Baron didnt see them but i just had to let him out. Me still sitting in the car told him 'hunt em up' and he started working. He worked the field and about 50 yards in flushed all of them.

Cant wait for the hunting season to start!

WTG Baron!!!!!

[BrianW]

Congrats that your pup is getting out there more and working the birds.

One resource that could be very useful is "Training the Pointing Labrador" by Julie Knutson.
Not just for PL's, there's lots of good info in a nicely presented style, not just the dry "textbook" approach.
One of her major points, as you've seen first hand, is "The Walk" in areas where there ARE birds. Keep quiet and don't talk constantly to the dog, let the birds do the talking. Don't take the same route everytime and get off the path yourself, out into the cover & the edges where the birds will be. Pup will go with you and make the discoveries he needs to develop the confidence & experience working the birds.
Good luck w/ your Pup.

[Archery1973]

I would really like EvanG's thoughts on this subject........