Frustrating Few Training Classes

[Tanya]

I've done training with Penny since I got her (Fall 2013). She was estimated to be around 8 months (ballpark) at that time. Basic Obedience went well. We moved on to agility all sumer (2014).

This winter we did Rally-O and are now taking a class as prep for Canine Good Neighbour test and I feel like both were way out of our league Classes are not really fun, in fact this session (CGN) is worse than the rally-o. We're struggling with our homework. I work hard to ensure I am calm and relaxed for training - Penny shuts down if I am the least bit frustrated so I learned to go into training periods relaxed or to not start/abort.

By the end of rally-o I found a groove that seemed to work for us which led to some improvement so there was that. But this new class wants to change my entire hand positions (both) as "it woudl work better". And it took me awhile to realize that - this was the issue. Penny is UBBER frustrated because I change my entire communication with her. She will leap and jump on me (which she has NEVER done before). They recommend leting the dog make a decision to find what gets them rewards but I am used to chatting wtih Penny.

In Rally I use my right hand (no treats) to direct pen. I guess it's sorta luring/focus point but no treats. My right hand is not behind my back. Do I keep working on this new technique or is it ok to use my right hand to guide? The rally-o instructor didn't say it would make me fail in rally-o and I don't intend to do obedience work.

The one thing that is going well is our fun trick training.

Has anyone else gone thru such a phase in training? My friend says Penny loved agility adn wants more of that - the fun stuff. But she/we NEED to work on manners type stuff and on her focus/inhibition control (to help with agility even). I get frustrated by each new class wanting to change your word/tecnique - I feel I am contstantly re-training stuff she knows with a new word, different hand signal blah blah blah.

ETA: I know I need to implement NILF with Penny. Having a hard time mentally with that one haha I think we both need it.

[Sue-Ram]

When I did obedience and the CGN prep course with Ram I kept being told that I should always have him on my left side. Well, I'm right handed and there is no way that holding a leash in my left hand feels natural to me. He passed both on my right side.

[Labradorks]

In all the training sessions I have taken, we hold the leash in our right hands with the dog on the left, and if you need to lure, treat, signal, etc., it is done with the left hand. If you watch competitive obedience or rally (the on-leash parts) this is the typical position. I feel like by using your right hand and having your dog on the left, it is harder for the dog to see your commands and definitely takes focus off of your face and is harder for them to read your body language. Plus, it can teach the dog to be crooked as he tries to watch and/or get treats from your right hand as he has to look across your body.

She certainly does sound like she is frustrated. Dogs are very sensitive to our cues, body language, voices, etc. and when you change things up, it can be hard on them. The jumping is "I don't know what you want!" language, it sounds like to me. Also, it should not matter what command you use and typically, hand signals don't matter much, either. Especially if your dog already knows them.

Since Penny likes agility and tricks, have you considered using fun games in your training? Like throwing treats, "on your pot" (I don't know what it's called, but if you google Janice Gunn and on your pot video you'll see), and similar exercises? It may decrease her stress and get her excited and listening to you better. You may also want to talk to the trainer about your commands and find out how important it is to change things up when Penny already knows them.

And yes, going through training set-backs is not fun. It's also normal. My dog is having difficulty with recall all of a sudden. After all this time...

[Tanya]

thanks for the feedback.

we did some training on our walk today and I went back to what I normally did - leash in right hand and "communication" with the right hand. She was abit jumpy but it felt better. I will just keep that up. she has issues with attention span though haha (totally normal)

will have to find info o nthe "find your pot"

We've happily added some new tricks to our "fun trick" portfolio in the last few weeks. Finally a big break thru on "shake paw" and peek-a-boo and bow. Working on weaving thru my legs (coming along nicely).

I find she doesn't like to do anything too often. Too repetitive and she seem sot be like "yeah, I did the sit/down/sit thing 10x - that's enough". even with the tricks. Keep the repetitions to minimal amount to practice then big long breaks.

[Snowshoe]

I was surprised at the ability to work in different sports, shall I call them, with different handling and sometimes I did have to come up with new words. But, we always trained only one activity at one time. Obedience, field work, agility, rally never overlapped time wise. Still we did have frustration with things occasionally and that's when I liked a vacation from training. None at all for a week, just fun. It worked but we did pretty well give up regular Rally and went out for Working Level in CARO. At Working Level there's more action, jumping, running and Oban likes that, maybe Penny would too? Except to compete in it you do need the Advanced title.

[Labradorks]

thanks for the feedback.

we did some training on our walk today and I went back to what I normally did - leash in right hand and "communication" with the right hand. She was abit jumpy but it felt better. I will just keep that up. she has issues with attention span though haha (totally normal)

will have to find info o nthe "find your pot"

We've happily added some new tricks to our "fun trick" portfolio in the last few weeks. Finally a big break thru on "shake paw" and peek-a-boo and bow. Working on weaving thru my legs (coming along nicely).

I find she doesn't like to do anything too often. Too repetitive and she seem sot be like "yeah, I did the sit/down/sit thing 10x - that's enough". even with the tricks. Keep the repetitions to minimal amount to practice then big long breaks.

Here's the on your pot write-up and video. There's actually a purpose to it, but I have found that my dogs love to do it and it's training plus so much fun. We use a clicker, which actually sped up their learning. I taped a phone book with duct tape to make it sturdy and say "get up there". You can say whatever you want!

The Denise Fenzi motivation and training games are good, too. And Janice Gunn has great ones also. They are very similar. I like Janice Gunn's presenting style a bit better and she has great videos on YouTube. Plus, she has a Lab...

The games between exercises will help with the attention span. I personally don't train often at all. Three times a week, five tops. One class, a private lesson, and a field class. Then, I might do a little bit of training once or twice. Maybe a match. I've never done more than that. I think that lots of repetitions over a short period of time bores them and stresses them out. Especially once they know it.

[Tanya]

I was surprised at the ability to work in different sports, shall I call them, with different handling and sometimes I did have to come up with new words. But, we always trained only one activity at one time. Obedience, field work, agility, rally never overlapped time wise. Still we did have frustration with things occasionally and that's when I liked a vacation from training. None at all for a week, just fun. It worked but we did pretty well give up regular Rally and went out for Working Level in CARO. At Working Level there's more action, jumping, running and Oban likes that, maybe Penny would too? Except to compete in it you do need the Advanced title.

I just wish there was a way to generalize. it's difficult to always come up with new words and retrain things "slightly differently" haha There wasn't overlap in the class, but we went from one to another (one week break) and I had really hoped to use one to launch into the other (building up on what we learned nto start over).

We had a good training walk yesterday. It's just about my remembering to keep the bar at the same place (not just no pull but stay at my knee and no farther). I am trying to mark when she is walking looking forward VS staring at me. And lots of talking

So our biggest issue is really the less formal "you don't have to heel but don't pull" issue but i'll wait til after class for that one. May have to bite the bullet and "be the tree" for that When "working" she is on a flat collar.

[Tanya]

Here's the on your pot write-up and video. There's actually a purpose to it, but I have found that my dogs love to do it and it's training plus so much fun. We use a clicker, which actually sped up their learning. I taped a phone book with duct tape to make it sturdy and say "get up there". You can say whatever you want!

The Denise Fenzi motivation and training games are good, too. And Janice Gunn has great ones also. They are very similar. I like Janice Gunn's presenting style a bit better and she has great videos on YouTube. Plus, she has a Lab...

The games between exercises will help with the attention span. I personally don't train often at all. Three times a week, five tops. One class, a private lesson, and a field class. Then, I might do a little bit of training once or twice. Maybe a match. I've never done more than that. I think that lots of repetitions over a short period of time bores them and stresses them out. Especially once they know it.

Thanks for the video and info. We work something similar but not exactly like that (haha!) so we can bring that into our "fun training".

By hard time concentrate I mean in class. We were doing loose leash weaves thru chairs (all 6 students - class isn't huge) for like 15 minutes, it was hard. Just like the Rally-o class that had us doign full 12+ stations courses day class 1.

I look forward to spring when I will be more likely to go train with her maybe down the street at the park. In teh winter we do some heeling but it's dark adn freezing to be doing much outside training. She works much better at home (obviously - like most dogs). Classrooms are high distraction and we are not quite ready to be THAT close to dogs all the time for loose leash (especially weaving aroudn chairs).