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  1. #1
    House Broken Lainie's Avatar
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    Diet advice driving us nuts!

    Haven't been here in months but many will remember Jessie & her skin problems, which, by the way, continue as ever. We have tried so many things to no avail that its maddening.
    Meanwhile, the diet is always blamed. She is very yeasty & when she gets going on chewing her paws incessantly, the smell is nasty. ProSeb shampoos help with the smell & give relief for a couple of days. Zincofax on her anus helps the itch....gross! Nothing helps for long. We've had her on raw now for about 2 years or so. It consists of raw ground meat (turkey or beef or duck), single protein only plus some ground bone & a small amount of fruits & veggies....carrot, apple, blueberry, kale.
    We have also been seeing a Naturopathic vet who is giving her Chinese herbs.....haven't helped.
    It was suggested to us recently by a new raw food supplier that we remove all fruits & veggies from her food so that there is not one bit of carbohydrate in it...in other words, 100% protein along with some raw green tripe occasionally. He is a strong believer is the Raw Prey diet.
    So we tried that, introducing duck as a new protein. Tripe stinks. And it caused farts that cleared the room. She loves it.
    We give her a little less which helps. But the itching hasn't been helped after 3 weeks of this.
    Meanwhile......we were at the regular vet, who doesn't like raw, & she was worried about Jessie on 100% protein. Jessie is 12 1/2 & vet says that much protein is hard on the kidneys & liver.
    She want me to add veggies, fruits & white or brown rice. When I explained we were avoiding anything that could feed yeast, she said carrots & apples were ok because there was enough fiber in them to counteract yeast growth. (I haven't found out yet what the Naturopath vet thinks of this....she is in favor of raw, btw.)
    Ok. But why do dogs need carbs at all, I wonder? Having read all kinds of studies on wolves, I understand that they rarely eat stomach contents of their prey. No, dogs are not wolves, but did they not evolve from wolves? Have dogs evolved to the point where they now need carbs? (Rhetorical/hypothetical questions, lol.)
    Now, let's go ahead & put the veggies & fruit back in.....I will avoid the rice, thank you.
    Next, I see on this board that people are of the opinion that raw only for senior dogs is not a good idea. Worse if the dog has cancer (Jessie does not that we know of). Their idea is that the bacteria in raw meat feeds cancer. Their advice is to either feed raw one meal & kibble the next, or, cook the raw food.
    My last resort is to see a nutritionist with all these questions....but does anybody have any opinion or experience in all of this???

  2. #2
    Senior Dog shellbell's Avatar
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    I am on a FB group for people who have dogs with yeast infections, and they promote (require to be in the group) raw feeding. And they are very strict that there should be NO fruits/veggies/grains at all, as all three of those things feed yeast. So that part I have heard before, and would say that could very well be true. Probably it would take longer than three weeks though to see a difference, when you remove those things from the diet. As for the protein being hard on her, the protein in raw is very different than the protein in a kibble diet. Not the same thing at all, and your vet might not realize that, they don't get much training in nutrition. This would not even be a flag on my radar, I plan on feeding prey model raw to my dogs for the rest of their lives. Bacteria in raw meat does not feed cancer. The only way this might be a concern, would be that a compromised immune system from cancer and chemo might make the dog more susceptible to bacteria. If (god forbid) one of my dogs is ever diagnosed with cancer, I will look into it more and would switch to homecooked if necessary. But just being a senior dog in general is NOT reason to stop raw.

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  4. #3
    House Broken Lainie's Avatar
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    Thanks shellbell....I know you're right about the type/amount of training vets get in nutrition. There is an pet nutritionist coming to our area near the end of this month & I think I will pay her a visit.
    This skin/itch problem Jessie has has been diagnosed as being caused by an immune system issue. But I would have trouble thinking that this would be the same as immune system issues due to cancer & its treatment.....been there, done that myself, so I understand the bacteria concern & when it should be a concern.
    I think I'll just continue on with her raw until I see this nutritionist & what she has to say & unless she has something that sounds huge to advise me of, I'm sticking to starving the yeast entirely.
    As a point of interest, I just got off the phone from a girl in CA that I found on the Pawhealer website. She has a masters in Traditional Chinese Medicine & has been treating pets for some time with acupuncture, herbs etc. Free advice: she feels Chinese herbs can help Jessie. She has been taking them but this girl things our herbal/vet needs to address another issue. Maybe I'll speak with her about that, but the funds are dwindling!! Thanks again!

  5. #4
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    I don’t know anything about feeding raw, but my understanding of why not to do it for a cancer patient is the same as shellbell’s - that the dog’s immune system might be too compromised to fight off any bacteria in the food, not that the bacteria is capable of feeding cancer. I have no idea what’s going on with your dog, but if it is similar to an allergic response, that’s usually due to a hyperactive immune system rather than a weakened one, so I would think the issues would be different.

    Hope you find something that helps - your poor girl sounds miserable.
    Annette

    Cookie (HIT HC Jamrah's Legally Blonde, UDX, OM2, BN) 6/4/2015
    Sassy (HIT Jamrah's Blonde Ambition, UDX, OM2, BN) 6/4/2015

    Chloe (HIT HC OTCH Windsong's Femme Fatale, UDX4, OM6, RE) 6/7/2009

    And remembering:

    Scully (HC Coventry's Truth Is Out There, UD, TD, RN) 4/14/1996 - 6/30/2011
    Mulder (Coventry's I Want To Believe, UD, RN, WC) 5/26/1999 - 4/22/2015

    And our foster Jolie (Windsong's Genuine Risk, CDX) 5/26/1999 - 3/16/2014

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  7. #5
    House Broken
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    I don't have experience in nutrition or food-related problems. But I am almost always in favor of a balanced diet. We feed a high quality dog food. Our dogs are pretty healthy.

  8. #6
    Real Retriever fidgetyknees's Avatar
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    I have a friend with a 6 year old that is going through beginning stages of kidney failure .... put me right off ever trying raw - and she is the kind of person who most likely is going the raw diet correctly.

    And another friend at work has gone through many foods in the past 6 months because of skin issues, he finally says they have found one that works. Orijin Six Fish. The dog apparently has gained energy as well. They were feeding a good brand before .... so it wasn't a matter of switching from grocery store food to good food. So maybe that dog food would be worth a try.

  9. #7
    Senior Dog voodoo's Avatar
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    ever tried apple cider vinegar?
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    Chili born 7/21/2013

  10. #8
    Best Friend Retriever Snowco Labradors's Avatar
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    I second the ACV give 1 tbsp. daily in food with water added. Braggs organic is a good brand - shake well before feeding. Helps ward off yeast. alfalfa is also an antifungal (yeast is fungal) and antibacterial. I would give 500 mg. in each meal. GNC has tablets. Give these time to work.

    As for kidney failure and protein. It is not high protein that is bad it is poor quality protein that is bad. Here is more info.

    https://www.b-naturals.com/newslette...s-senior-dogs/

    https://www.b-naturals.com/newslette...n-in-the-diet/

  11. #9
    Senior Dog shellbell's Avatar
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    Yeah, it would not even be on my radar that kidney problems would have any relation to feeding raw. For what it's worth, I've been feeding it for four years now, I do full blood chemistry panels every year and they always come back perfect.

  12. #10
    Senior Dog Berna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shellbell View Post
    Yeah, it would not even be on my radar that kidney problems would have any relation to feeding raw. For what it's worth, I've been feeding it for four years now, I do full blood chemistry panels every year and they always come back perfect.
    This.

    Kidney failure can happen for so many reasons not related to food.
    Cookie Black Snowflake
    July 12th, 2006. - May 25th, 2023.

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