Starting a new club? Advice? Experience?

[Labradorks]

I know there aren't too many obedience folks here, but just in case, wanted to ask...

Our local club just lost their space due to rent increases. They will be opening a new one at some point, I suppose, but it looks like they will be in an area where a match here and there might make sense, but too far away for a lot of people to travel to for regular ring rental.

The club tolerates over the top punishment of dogs -- in my opinion, and yes I have brought it up to a board member only to be poo-pooed -- which causes duress for some people and dogs (stomping, yelling, slapping, ear pulling, slamming into walls, jerking several feet, laying on them, kneeing them in the face, etc.). There is also a lack of personal support, especially for newer members or people who are just nervous being in a ring. For some people (and dogs) matches are a place to build confidence and this rarely happens here, which is really sad.

So, a few friends and I have been thinking about starting our own club with a different culture. We are all "Novice A" folks that have been in dogs for a long time but are just now starting to get into competition. I met another Lab person at a match who is a Utility B person and she and her Utility B friends are in the same boat in their area. They train together and have similar issues with their local club (we are three hours apart). As we got to talking, we recognized that we have a mix of experience, but the same goals and I guess morals for lack of a better word. So, this is good!

Now that things have come to a head with the recent loss of training space and I had an experience over the weekend that left my dog and me to be shut down in the ring during a match (the first time my dog has shut down in a ring in a year and this is a familiar ring that we visit several times per month and a first for me) and my new friend in the other area happened to email me with a situation that left her shaking her head at a recent match she attended and judged at, we decided to take this club thing seriously.

We're just not sure where to start. Any ideas?

[Annette47]

Well, just off the top of my head, you will need a space to work in. Then you will also need to agree on some rules as to how it works - who can join, what (if any) are the responsibilities of membership. Since training methods are of concern for you, how will you regulate it? Will there be specific rules as to what things are unacceptable or will you try to promote a general philosophy. What will happen if someone violates those rules/philosophy? How will disputes be resolved if they deny it? Will you charge for membership and what will the money be used for. Who will keep track of it? Are you planning on just training together informally or will someone function as an instructor? If so, how will they be compensated? Cash, free ring time, etc. Will you be hoping to eventually host trials? That is a whole process that requires approval from the AKC, although fun matches can be held by anyone. If you are going to be holding matches open to the general public and intend to regulate the training methods people use at them, then you’ll need to be VERY specific in your advertising.

Is there really a need for an actual club or could you be ok with just an informal group who trains together - splits the costs of ring rentals, etc., or are you looking for something more formal? By us, there is one actual AKC sanctioned Obedience club, that I belong to but am no longer active in as Obedience has become a tiny part of things - it is much more focused on Agility now. There are also quite a few training centers which offer classes - instructors are usually experienced OTCH level trainers. For those you pay by the class, but many function as a club too in terms of volunteering to host events, etc. All decisions are made by the business owners though, which does make things run a lot easier than I have seen with clubs. If you have an issue with how things are done then you just go to another place. Most people I know who compete in this area go to classes at one of these “schools”, often belong to a trial hosting club as well and also get together with friends to rent space and practice.

Clubs seem to be a dying breed, which is a shame as they are the ones hosting trials.

[Labradorks]

Well, just off the top of my head, you will need a space to work in. Then you will also need to agree on some rules as to how it works - who can join, what (if any) are the responsibilities of membership. Since training methods are of concern for you, how will you regulate it? Will there be specific rules as to what things are unacceptable or will you try to promote a general philosophy. What will happen if someone violates those rules/philosophy? How will disputes be resolved if they deny it? Will you charge for membership and what will the money be used for. Who will keep track of it? Are you planning on just training together informally or will someone function as an instructor? If so, how will they be compensated? Cash, free ring time, etc. Will you be hoping to eventually host trials? That is a whole process that requires approval from the AKC, although fun matches can be held by anyone. If you are going to be holding matches open to the general public and intend to regulate the training methods people use at them, then you’ll need to be VERY specific in your advertising.

Is there really a need for an actual club or could you be ok with just an informal group who trains together - splits the costs of ring rentals, etc., or are you looking for something more formal? By us, there is one actual AKC sanctioned Obedience club, that I belong to but am no longer active in as Obedience has become a tiny part of things - it is much more focused on Agility now. There are also quite a few training centers which offer classes - instructors are usually experienced OTCH level trainers. For those you pay by the class, but many function as a club too in terms of volunteering to host events, etc. All decisions are made by the business owners though, which does make things run a lot easier than I have seen with clubs. If you have an issue with how things are done then you just go to another place. Most people I know who compete in this area go to classes at one of these “schools”, often belong to a trial hosting club as well and also get together with friends to rent space and practice.

Clubs seem to be a dying breed, which is a shame as they are the ones hosting trials.

We've discussed some of these things. But some we have not, so thank you!

[JenC]

I don't know if you need space. Maybe for a new club, I don't know. We have a club locally here that doesn't do training classes anymore, I assume they have meetings...

Go on the AKC site, there are step by step instructions.

[Labradorks]

I don't know if you need space. Maybe for a new club, I don't know. We have a club locally here that doesn't do training classes anymore, I assume they have meetings...

Go on the AKC site, there are step by step instructions.

Most of the clubs I am aware of do not have their own space, but have a large space they rent weekly for several hours (like from 6pm - 10pm) during the week. They either hold several classes by the hour or have two to four rings set up to run classes, drop-ins and ring time simultaneously.

I will look at the site. Before reading this I tried to see if they had anything, but the site was not cooperating.

Thanks!

[JenC]

yeah, I am aware of how a training club may operate and hold classes. But what I was saying is that I don't know if having the training classes is mandatory in having a performance club. We started a conformation club. We had to have a certain number of C matches and hold a certain number of meetings, create by-laws, and get enough members.

The link is here https://images.akc.org/pdf/rulebooks/RCFORM.pdf

[barry581]

Clubs seem to be a dying breed, which is a shame as they are the ones hosting trials.

As a new comer to the whole performance dog/training class world I'd like to make a few observations:

1. It's predominantly women involve in the sport. This is neither good nor bad. I was the only male in the 3 classes I took at Petsmart. I was the only male in the 2 CGC classes I took. I was the only male in the Rally class I took. There are two males (me +1) in the Obedience class I'm taking.

2. The average age of people I see taking classes are over 40, well established in careers, children out of the nest, and available disposable income. The board members at the club where I did Rally classes were all as old as me or older, some considerably older.

These two things combine for less and less available customers/clients/members, and it seems not much is being done to bring new or younger people into the sport. Getting into this sport is not cheap either. The cost of a pure bred dog could be prohibitive, but you can register a recuse and compete. The price of classes, transportation, supplies and equipment, entry fees, travel expenses, etc all add up.

I'm 57 years old, and pretty much brand new to the sport. Since we do not have a local club here in Dover, I'd love to see one, but I just don't see it happening, as I just don't think there in nearly enough demand for it. I know the AKC has a junior handler program for conformation, but I don't see anything for the other competitive dog sports, so where is the next generation of competitors coming from?? Someone like me may compete for 5-10 years. We need people coming into the sport who will be it for the next 40 years...................

[Labradorks]

As a new comer to the whole performance dog/training class world I'd like to make a few observations:

1. It's predominantly women involve in the sport. This is neither good nor bad. I was the only male in the 3 classes I took at Petsmart. I was the only male in the 2 CGC classes I took. I was the only male in the Rally class I took. There are two males (me +1) in the Obedience class I'm taking.

2. The average age of people I see taking classes are over 40, well established in careers, children out of the nest, and available disposable income. The board members at the club where I did Rally classes were all as old as me or older, some considerably older.

These two things combine for less and less available customers/clients/members, and it seems not much is being done to bring new or younger people into the sport. Getting into this sport is not cheap either. The cost of a pure bred dog could be prohibitive, but you can register a recuse and compete. The price of classes, transportation, supplies and equipment, entry fees, travel expenses, etc all add up.

I'm 57 years old, and pretty much brand new to the sport. Since we do not have a local club here in Dover, I'd love to see one, but I just don't see it happening, as I just don't think there in nearly enough demand for it. I know the AKC has a junior handler program for conformation, but I don't see anything for the other competitive dog sports, so where is the next generation of competitors coming from?? Someone like me may compete for 5-10 years. We need people coming into the sport who will be it for the next 40 years...................

All are pretty much true on this side of the country as well.

Nothing is being done by clubs, as far as I can tell, to bring in younger members. They can be clicque-y, unwelcoming and unsupportive. They don't like change. I saw some numbers recently. Agility is way up. Conformation is down. Obedience and rally are static. The old timers tell me that every year since they have been in the sport (they will then say, "100 years!") they have been asking where the next generation will come from and how will the sport survive!?!? Somehow it keeps on keeping on... The clubs locally are not doing so well. One turned into mostly an agility and as I mentioned previously, the other one just had to shut down their training building, which was the only reason 90% of the club members even signed up.

Denise Fenzi did an informal poll on her Facebook and surprisingly many people were under 40. Sure, there are lots of people that take her online classes that did not participate, so it's imperfect. But several hundred people is a decent number. Many of those people do not have in-person trainers or classes or belong to clubs. Their training was online with the occasional seminar and peer support either online on in person or both. Definitely a crowd that is comfortable with technology and aren't going to train locally if they can't find someone they click with. Many people trained their dogs for years when they were younger, only stopping due to time or money or both, then getting back into it and/or more serious after the kids are gone or they are more settled financially (or both). I think this cycle is true for a lot of people, which is one reason why so many members are older. Locally we have a very strong dog 4H club and they do AKC obedience and rally as well as showmanship (conformation). I'm assuming they also do agility.

Obedience doesn't have to be torture -- for the dog or the handler! It can be fun.

[dxboon]

As a new comer to the whole performance dog/training class world I'd like to make a few observations:

1. It's predominantly women involve in the sport. This is neither good nor bad. I was the only male in the 3 classes I took at Petsmart. I was the only male in the 2 CGC classes I took. I was the only male in the Rally class I took. There are two males (me +1) in the Obedience class I'm taking.

2. The average age of people I see taking classes are over 40, well established in careers, children out of the nest, and available disposable income. The board members at the club where I did Rally classes were all as old as me or older, some considerably older.

These two things combine for less and less available customers/clients/members, and it seems not much is being done to bring new or younger people into the sport. Getting into this sport is not cheap either. The cost of a pure bred dog could be prohibitive, but you can register a recuse and compete. The price of classes, transportation, supplies and equipment, entry fees, travel expenses, etc all add up.

I'm 57 years old, and pretty much brand new to the sport. Since we do not have a local club here in Dover, I'd love to see one, but I just don't see it happening, as I just don't think there in nearly enough demand for it. I know the AKC has a junior handler program for conformation, but I don't see anything for the other competitive dog sports, so where is the next generation of competitors coming from?? Someone like me may compete for 5-10 years. We need people coming into the sport who will be it for the next 40 years...................

Anything involving purebred dogs in general is on a decline due to the success of AR groups convincing the general public that breeders, dog shows, and purebred dogs are undesirable; obviously on the performance side you can now do a ton of things with mixed breeds, so there's some flexibility there. Having been a board member, and for the last few years an officer in my local breed club, sustaining the organization is tough. We have actually grown our club the last two years, but I think that's very unusual. The problem is not only people aging out (literally dying and thus leaving the sport), but very few people want to actually do any heavy lifting in order to hold events. You find the same half dozen or so people who are the core "do-ers." There are plenty of people who want to complain about how things are run, or how things are cliqueish, but then when it comes time to ask for people to volunteer to be on the board or to chair committees or do anything except show up for the show or trial; run their dogs and chat with their friends, well, you could hear a pin drop. In my breed club, basically we've got one person who has the energy and will to organize the rally/obedience portion of our club and who can gather a few folks to help steward and assist with the annual trial. If she left, I don't know if we could sustain that segment of our club.

[Labradorks]

Anything involving purebred dogs in general is on a decline due to the success of AR groups convincing the general public that breeders, dog shows, and purebred dogs are undesirable; obviously on the performance side you can now do a ton of things with mixed breeds, so there's some flexibility there. Having been a board member, and for the last few years an officer in my local breed club, sustaining the organization is tough. We have actually grown our club the last two years, but I think that's very unusual. The problem is not only people aging out (literally dying and thus leaving the sport), but very few people want to actually do any heavy lifting in order to hold events. You find the same half dozen or so people who are the core "do-ers." There are plenty of people who want to complain about how things are run, or how things are cliqueish, but then when it comes time to ask for people to volunteer to be on the board or to chair committees or do anything except show up for the show or trial; run their dogs and chat with their friends, well, you could hear a pin drop. In my breed club, basically we've got one person who has the energy and will to organize the rally/obedience portion of our club and who can gather a few folks to help steward and assist with the annual trial. If she left, I don't know if we could sustain that segment of our club.

I think all volunteer organizations are like this to some extent. Of the five or so I have been involved with heavily, mostly dog related but not all, they have all had a core group of people doing most of the work. I've been on two boards and have been an officer and it's the same issues all around. The difference I have seen is that some key members are better at engaging other members and volunteers than others. Even though they are my friends, some core club members are cliqueish and unwelcoming. I think key members of a club should go out of their way to make new members feel welcome, introduce them to people and help them find a volunteer opportunity that meets their strengths and interests. Similarly, new members need to realize that Rome was not built in a day. Friendships were already forged and it takes time to make new friends and figure out the ropes.