Mouthing the bird

[TuMicks]

So I've described the last flier experience I had with Rocket Dog and the fact that she was mouthing it badly and sticky on it when I tried to take it.

Was talking with a friend of mine about it. She stated that the dog's job is always to get back with the bird and deliver ASAP. I am guilty of only thinking about what happens from the line to the bird... i.e., the part of the test that shows up on the judges' books. So that's what I have focused on in training, especially when it's just Rocket Dog and me.

So, what this friend brought up is that the behavior where RD is running back celebrating her flier and then reluctant to surrender it can be remedied (or maybe ameliorated) by reinforcing HERE on the return, i.e., HERE-nick. I think that makes sense, and if fact, the pro has said similar things to me before, just not in the context of mouthing. (I mean, this is NOT a dog with mouthing issues. She doesn't do this with others. This is a "you're-not-the-boss-of-me" issue.)

It makes sense to me to force the LAST half of the retrieve as a means of stopping the behavior rather than ponding her when she returns. Too complicated. It's possible she might not be clear on what she's getting punished for... returning to the line? Standing next to me? Or mouthing the bird? I think the HERE-nick is preferable to using direct pressure on DROP at the line when the problem has already started.

Again... this dog has been properly force fetched. She doesn't do this with dead birds or with bumpers. She doesn't do fliers this way with other people. This is specifically her response to not wanting to surrender her favorite thing to me.

[Labradorks]

When things go awry with my dog, I get out the video recorder and tape myself. I always assume it's me, not the dog, that is causing the issue first. Mistakes are often handler error and we all do things we don't realize we are doing when we are working with our dogs. 99% of the time when I am unhappy about a performance, I am giving my dog mixed signals or accidentally adding pressure or causing stress/worry due to my own lack of confidence. Because the dog only does this to you, you might want to video yourself and get some feedback (I run my videos by my trainers and we discuss). The dog knows what to do and it sounds like the common denominator might be you since she doesn't do this with anyone else. I would not be quick to assume it's the dog.

[Annette47]

When things go awry with my dog, I get out the video recorder and tape myself. I always assume it's me, not the dog, that is causing the issue first. Mistakes are often handler error and we all do things we don't realize we are doing when we are working with our dogs. 99% of the time when I am unhappy about a performance, I am giving my dog mixed signals or accidentally adding pressure or causing stress/worry due to my own lack of confidence. Because the dog only does this to you, you might want to video yourself and get some feedback (I run my videos by my trainers and we discuss). The dog knows what to do and it sounds like the common denominator might be you since she doesn't do this with anyone else. I would not be quick to assume it's the dog.

I don’t worry about stressing my dogs as much as Labradorks does (mine seem to be more resilient) but I do have to agree with the thought that 99% of the time it’s the handler, especially if the dog has shown they understand the exercise in different conditions/situations (or in your case with different people). Can you have some experienced people watch with a focus on watching what YOU are doing? It might be that you aren’t firm enough with her in which case your solution seems appropriate, but it could also be that you are doing something else different that is causing it and I would want to rule it out.

I had posted here a couple weeks ago about Chloe having trouble running straight lines on go-outs. Turns out it was my fault. I apparently have trouble judging straight lines outdoors (indoors there is usually floor matting you can see seams in to judge) and was not lining her up straight, but thought I was. It took my husband, who knows very little about dog training watching me to figure it out. Once I started lining her up straight to the stanchion, her go-outs became flawless again. She had been getting confused because she was taking the straight line I was giving her and then getting corrected for not ending up in the right place.

That said, her father had issues on go-outs at one point because he had been trained to run to the stanchion and get food off of it, and he would blow off the sit command in favor of searching to see if there was a treat on the stanchion. In that case it most definitely was the dog! (An e-collar fixed that as he needed to know I could correct him from a distance).

So, my point is just, have someone who knows what they’re doing watch you to help with accurately diagnosing the problem and then take it from there.

[TuMicks]

Without a DOUBT... I was doing wrong things and you can be sure my pro reamed me a new one about it. In that moment, I had simply put my hand down expecting the bird to be dropped in it like it was a training dummy. I did not even give the verbal command to DROP (usually my hand IS the command). But the folks observing me saw the behavior (rolling the bird) as she came back and they were anticipating what would happen next. Not that anyone had the time to talk about it... this was happening pretty fast. And in that moment, I should have gotten very firm with her and did not, aggravating the situation. Then I put my hand on the bird... another no-no. Now this dog who is high as a meth addict after a fix started tug-of-war. Very, very bad.

So I know I'm going to be scrutinized when we go training today.

I know Labradorks is right about videoing. I'm going to have to do that some day, but must get my courage up (and maybe a tripod or something) before I can bring myself to do it.

[Labradorks]

I'm going to have to do that some day, but must get my courage up (and maybe a tripod or something) before I can bring myself to do it.

Why do you need courage to video yourself? Once you get over whatever your insecurities are and focus on your handling and how it affects your dog, it's priceless! And, you don't need to show it to anyone.

[TuMicks]

When I was younger, I played the flute. Then one day my private teacher recorded me. I could NOT believe that's what it sounded like when I played. From my side of the flute, the sound was totally different. I was appalled. As a professor, I've had to record lectures. On playback, I sound like a prepubescent boy. So, with regard to handling the dog, I'm confident what I FEEL like I'm doing with my body on the line is totally different than what I am, in fact, doing. Which is, of course, the reason we need that videotape. My head agrees with you. My ego will eventually fall in line. So you set your phone/camera on a tripod or something?

[TuMicks]

No mouthing today. Sat like a statue (even for the walk up). No noise in the blind, on the line or on the send. So... some progress. (Neither one of us marked the triple very well in grass that almost reached the dog's ears. But I still think it was a good outing.)

[Labradorks]

When I was younger, I played the flute. Then one day my private teacher recorded me. I could NOT believe that's what it sounded like when I played. From my side of the flute, the sound was totally different. I was appalled. As a professor, I've had to record lectures. On playback, I sound like a prepubescent boy. So, with regard to handling the dog, I'm confident what I FEEL like I'm doing with my body on the line is totally different than what I am, in fact, doing. Which is, of course, the reason we need that videotape. My head agrees with you. My ego will eventually fall in line. So you set your phone/camera on a tripod or something?

I don't love watching or listening to myself either, and the first time I videoed myself it took me some time to watch, so I just ignore that stuff and focus on the important stuff.

I bought an inexpensive tripod on Amazon for my iPad, which I believe also works with an iPhone.

[Annette47]

When I was younger, I played the flute. Then one day my private teacher recorded me. I could NOT believe that's what it sounded like when I played. From my side of the flute, the sound was totally different. I was appalled. As a professor, I've had to record lectures. On playback, I sound like a prepubescent boy. So, with regard to handling the dog, I'm confident what I FEEL like I'm doing with my body on the line is totally different than what I am, in fact, doing. Which is, of course, the reason we need that videotape. My head agrees with you. My ego will eventually fall in line. So you set your phone/camera on a tripod or something?

LOL ... I’m a professor too, and my students always ask if it is ok of they tape lectures for later review. I always say “yes, as long as I don’t have to listen to them!”